Template talk:Sherlock Holmes screen adaptations

Format is too wide

The current format of this template is insanely wasteful of horizontal space. It's so wide that it takes up more than 90 characters, which is the width of the WP text area as I view it on my browser. The format is the standard one-line headings in a separate column. This is okay for navigation by things like years or decades, because the heading are short and there's only one level of headings, so they all fit in one narrow column. But it doesn't work for this template. The headings are much longer, many of the film titles are longer than usual, and there are two levels, so (a) there are two columns of headers, (b) both of them are fairly wide, and (c) the long titles force the box to be even wider. I made two alternative formats, but an anonymous editor reverted both of them. These are the formats I created:

The problem may not be obvious if you use a small font on a large screen, but it's awful otherwise. The current format takes up 2 1/2 pages and hangs out past the right edge of the text area, even though the "Sherlock Holmes and..." titles are abbreviated. Almost anything else would be better. —Codrdan (talk) 11:32, 21 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Message to 76.229.211.37

Dear 76.229.211.37: Please stop edit warring. I've provided detailed explanations of my edits and temporarily accepted some of your preferences, even though I think they're misguided, while most of your reversions have no explanation at all and you haven't even bothered to register. I don't see any basis for your edits except knee-jerk contrariness. It doesn't make sense to abbreviate some titles but not others when they have exactly the same form ("S.H. and..."), and even worse, some of the unabbreviated titles are exactly the ones that are making the table too wide. —Codrdan (talk) 15:37, 21 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Murder rooms

Murder Rooms was listed here under both Ian Richardson and separately as a TV series. I do have some doubts about it being here, as it is not an adaption, although it has obvious Holmes influences. However it seems really strange to have it twice and misleading to have it listed under Ian Richardson as he was not playing Holmes in it, so I have removed the first entry and left the Television series one. Dunarc (talk) 19:58, 11 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

removing of content

Hi. Mostly silent reader here, but I hope my opinion isn't viewed as less because I'm not registered (also, English isn't my first language).

In the past few days, ThaddeusSholto has removed several entries from the template. I see that he seems to have gotten into Holmes at great length, but that doesn't make him the sole authority on what counts as an adaptation. The problem with Holmes is that he is in the public domain, and therefore appears in a number of works in more or less major roles.

As reasons he gives are "pastiche (...) isn't an adaptation" or "Sherlock (...) is a minor character.", which initially sound like valid reasons. And I don't want to deny that some of the works in question are quite borderline (is this the right expression?) and could well be up for discussion (which Thaddeus didn't do, he went straight to action), but not more than other titles that have been part of this template for years without objection. We have works about his sister, his grandniece, a man who thinks he is the detective, another man who thinks he is the detective, and even a talking mouse, just to name a few. Just because the main character might not be named Sherlock Holmes doesn't automatically mean that a work can't still be Sherlockian. And unless anyone can provide me with a guideline as to why an English show about the supernatural with Holmes in a suporting role should be relevant, but a Japanese one shouldn't, I can only assume that Thaddeus was just following his personal tastes here. The only other alternative would be to stick strictly to Conan Doyle's works, and that can't be the solution either. --2003:C0:3F0D:3D78:755D:DDE6:4340:A562 (talk) 17:52, 11 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, not as many participants as I was hoping for. But I realize that I may have gone this the wrong way, and should focus more on the titles in question, for people who aren't that into the subject.

Tantei Opera Milky Holmes, Aria the Scarlet Ammo and Ron Kamonohashi: Deranged Detective are all about descendants of Holmes in the present. I myself am not familiar with all of them either. but from what I've heard Holmes appears in Milky Holmes for at least a few episodes, in Aria not in the anime itself but in some of the later books it is based on, and in Ron Kamonohashi the Moriartys are the main antagonists. So they are by no means just adaptations in name only. As a compromise, I would suggest a separate category about his relatives. In addition to the three just mentioned, this would also contain Enola Holmes, Enola Holmes 2, The Adventures of Shirley Holmes and The Strange Case of the End of Civilization as We Know It (plus The Adventure of Sherlock Holmes' Smarter Brother, if we include Theatrical films two). It has always bothered me anyway that the two Enola films are listed under Henry Cavill, even though he is not the main character.

Now for the other three titles in which Holmes supposedly only have a minor role.
Lupin the 3rd Part 6: The conflict between Arsene Lupine and Holmes is as old as the gentleman thief himself. The story arc "Lupine III vs. Holmes" occupies the first half of the series. And in addition to Holmes himself, all the his supporting characters appear as well, such as Watson, Lestrade, Mrs. Hudson, Moriarty and Colonel Moran. I honestly have no idea how anyone would think the series wasn't about Holmes who read more than the title.
The Tale of the Outcasts: Holmes and/or Watson appears in 6 of the 13 episodes. Although their roles are in fact not particularly big in some places, they are nonetheless crucial. A crucial part of the Big Bad's backstory is tied to Watson's time in Afghanistan. Also, Holmes is both here and in Moriarty the Patriot played by Makoto Furukawa, which adds him to a small list alongside Cushing, Lee, Plummer and Wilmer of Actors, who portrayed the role twice. That alone should make the show noteworthy.
Undead Girl Murder Farce: Okay, this case is a bit tricky, since the show isn't starting for a couple of weeks. However, Holmes' name was already mentioned in the first press release about the series, and he was one of the first characters whose voice actor was announced. Everything points to him having a leading role in the series.

Some of this shows have been part of this template for 9 years and so far only one person has spoken out against them. One should ask the question: What is the point of this template? Obviously to let people know what movies and series there are about Holmes or themes related to him. They can then read through the articles and decide for themself if they are of interest to them. But that is not possible if we make a pre-selection for them. Especially not when these are apparently not based on any transparent criteria. -2003:C0:3F0D:3D79:100F:EAD3:986A:D15D (talk) 12:24, 13 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

An extremely minor character in a show that otherwise has nothing at all to do with Sherlock Holmes is not by definition an "adaptation of Sherlock Holmes". If we include any and all cameos, references, etc this infobox will be far too large to be useful. It is already too large as it is and filled with films and shows that aren't adaptations in any meaningful sense. ThaddeusSholto (talk) 19:58, 26 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Split

The template has grown so large I suggest splitting into two infoboxes; one for film adaptations and one for television adaptations. ThaddeusSholto (talk) 20:59, 26 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]