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Did you know?
Did you know?
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This is where the Did you know section on the main page, its policies and the featured items can be discussed.

Double Carnegie hook

Hi, my double hook for Carnegie (ship) and the Carnegie Ridge on August 25, is still unchecked. I'm not complaining, but just want to point out that I will be on a bit of a wikibreak from tomorrow, so I would be grateful if someone could take a look at them, that way, if there are any issues I can respond before I travel, thanks. Mikenorton (talk) 19:52, 2 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Now ticked, so I can sign off, thanks. Mikenorton (talk) 08:45, 3 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Hook on toilet water in Prep area 2

Hi, I was just writing an approval note on ALT4 of this hook when it was taken off the suggestions page and ALT1 was placed here. Both the nominator and I felt that ALT4 was a little bit more hookier:

... that King of France Louis XIV (1638–1715) perfumed his shirts with toilet water?

Would it still be possible to change that? -- Zoeperkoe (talk) 01:09, 3 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

IMHO this is decidedly less hooky and interesting because it's missing the "heavenly water" part. — Rlevse • Talk • 01:16, 3 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

And whoever put "toilet water" before "heavenly water" made the hook better. I have high hopes for that hook, it is good. --NortyNort (Holla) 10:29, 3 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Kloster Berge school

I am posting this here at User:Cirt's suggestion . . .

Klosterbergen was at AfD, so I completely rewrote it, correcting the errors of fact and expanding it more than fivefold, moved it to the correct title, Kloster Berge school, and since there turned out to be an interesting hook fact, put it up for DYK. However, Cirt relisted the AfD to get more participation, and as I expected, taht means the nomination went stale and got junked [1]. Cirt evidently thought a pending AfD would entail some extra time, and still tells me there should be an exception made in such cases. I clearly should not take a position on whether the article should be kept or not, but it's a radical rewrite, so . . . I'm mentioning it as he suggested. Yngvadottir (talk) 18:07, 3 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Strongly recommend allowing this to be considered as a DYK candidate. Exceptions should most definitely be made to articles pending candidacy due to ongoing AFD discussion. -- Cirt (talk) 18:08, 3 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Heh, I see it is still at AFD right now. I still think it should be allowed to be a candidate at DYK, but of course that would have to wait until after the ongoing AFD is closed and resolved. At that point in time, it can be considered. :) -- Cirt (talk) 18:24, 3 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I also think that should remain a DYK candidate. I've alway thought our practice was that DYK nominations where the article was at AfD were put on hold until the AfD was resolved. This can delay it beyond our normal time-frame, but if it survives the AfD, the DYK should still be permitted. cmadler (talk) 12:47, 4 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Agree with Cmadler (talk · contribs), but yea, at the moment, it still is at AFD. -- Cirt (talk) 19:24, 4 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The AfD has now been closed as keep. Yngvadottir (talk) 15:15, 7 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

This is fine to go to DYK it should get a priority as it has been checked for many things already Victuallers (talk) 16:20, 7 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

File:Maduru_Oya_National_Park.jpg

I just made this image the lead for what is currently in PrepExtra then noticed it is on Commons but with a copy right tag. Have invited the uploaded, Chanakal, to comment here. So how is this free when it has a copyright tag? — Rlevse • Talk • 14:51, 4 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

On seeing this thread I suspected possible flickr washing, but the upload appears to be legitimate. Backtracking to the original Flickr image shows the name in the watermark matches the name on the account and that the image is licensed under CC-BY-SA. While the watermark is annoying it does not conflict with the upload information and everything else I can see checks out. --Allen3 ^talk 15:13, 4 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

When uploading the photo, watermark is certainly annoyed me. However I proceeded as the information matched and I've seen images by the same author in our articles such as this image. Although the author releases the image under creative commons license, seems to me he fears the users might not attribute him credit properly.--Chanaka L (talk) 15:59, 4 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with Allen3, this appears to be legitimate. Digital watermarking happens; there's even a commons template for this.cmadler (talk) 17:41, 4 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Albanian Riviera

Template:Did you know/Queue/5 has 2 consecutive Albanian Riviera hooks. I think the usual practice is to at least separate them, or put them in different queue files. Art LaPella (talk) 18:35, 4 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I've separated them. — Rlevse • Talk • 19:21, 4 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Taurus-Littrow

The Taurus-Littrow hook in PrepExtra should read: ...that the mountains surrounding the Taurus-Littrow valley, the landing site of Apollo 17 on the Moon, are higher than the Grand Canyon is deep? This was the version that was approved. Thanks, Tyrol5 [Talk] 13:28, 5 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Vietnamese provinces

Extremely disappointing that the 11 article Vietnam province marathon currently on the front page didn't even make it to the lead hook when the current two are barely beond stub class. Dr. Blofeld 08:07, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Comment relocated from suggestions page. - Dravecky (talk) 09:37, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Might just be me, but a lead hook stating that 11 different Vietnamese-named places are provinces of Vietnam isn't a very interesting lead hook. JMO, but I agree with the admin's decision to not use it as lead. Strange Passerby (talk) 11:37, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Not a glimmer of appreciation for the extreme hard work that went into the articles is my point. Why do we bother? Dr. Blofeld 13:20, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Someone took the time to review 11 articles in hook and promote them. Also, there have been recent lead hooks on Vietnam. Is there some rule that says "if there are several new articles in a hook it has to be the lead hook"? — Rlevse • Talk • 13:24, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

First of all, Dr. Blofeld, lead hooks are chosen on the basis of interestingness and, particularly, what has a good picture to go along with it. As far as I know, we almost never use maps (neither does TFA). Secondly, coming here to complain about your own hook like this is not very classy...

@ everyone else: I would not worry about this too much. Dr. Blofeld is a hardworking editor but he does have some extreme views when it comes to geographical and city articles, he seems to think those are the only articles that deserve peoples' attention. In fact, he has in the past called me and another editor nationalist Uyghur sympathizers because we didn't spend all of our time working on city articles ([2][3]. rʨanaɢ (talk) 13:34, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

(ec) For DYK purposes, I think the articles were represented well. Otherwise, they are good articles and a fine addition to Wikipedia. Not every new article can be or has been made into a DYK. Nothing to be disheartened by, especially if it was just placement.--NortyNort (Holla) 13:39, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Use of public domain information in DYK articles

Following on from this discussion a couple of weeks ago, I'd like to clarify the situation on whether or not we should promote articles for inclusion in DYK if they are largely a copy + paste of a public domain source? Currently John Greenhill is on T:TDYK (here) and the editor has admitted that it is mainly copied from the Dictionary of National Biography. Considering that a few weeks ago an article which had many other sources, but was mainly built around a PD source, was declined, should we do the same for this nomination? If so, should we add a note to the rules to let editors know that articles using PD text are not eligible? Smartse (talk) 16:01, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

We shouldn't promote such articles. This has been discussed several times over the past year or two, I'll see what I can find in the archives. rʨanaɢ (talk) 16:19, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Just in case a ref is not found. My understanding is - An article cannot be cut and pasted from a PD source, but of course a subject that is in a PD source is not banned from DYK. PD sources can be used ..... but you cannot cut and paste. Articles need to be original Victuallers (talk) 16:27, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

A sampling of past discussions:

Some of these are more about specific cases and some are more conceptual. I haven't taken the time to read through all of them and gauge consensus, but my recollection is that there is usually a consensus (perhaps only a slight one) against using PD copy-paste articles. I should note, though, that I am a pretty vocal anti-copy-paste person, so my judgment of the consensus might be biased. rʨanaɢ (talk) 16:32, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

If 1500 characters readable prose of the said article were original, I don't see why it shouldn't be elidible. But then again, its whole text would have to come under close scrutiny for paraphrasing as well. I am also not a fan of copying and pasting.--NortyNort (Holla) 16:56, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I have a feeling that these often fairly large copied-and-pasted articles from EB, Catholic Encyclopaedia, DNB etc. discourage new and original writing (not original research, there is a difference). Many stay more or less the same for years, and Wikipedia editors appear to feel bound by a disposition and content determined by a 19th-century view of a topic rather than recent research. If the purpose of DYK is to encourage new writing representing a current view of a topic, as I believe it should be, these copied PD texts should be disallowed from DYK and if a new replacement article eventually gets written, it should be regarded as completely new, even if it isn't five times larger than the content it replaces.

Another point: DYK credits are clearly valued by many users, and it is hardly fair to those users who actually make an effort researching and writing articles, if some users get DYK credits for just copying something without even trying to rewrite it in their own words. (Disclaimer: I have written articles based at least in part on articles in the more recent ODNB. I try to rewrite in my own words and summarize sources rather than make uncomfortably close paraphrases, even if means that the article ends up shorter than it could otherwise have been.) --Hegvald (talk) 18:56, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

There are articles almost entirely composed of PD text which have made it to FA. If they are good enough for FA, I don't see why they shouldn't be good enough for DYK. As long as the text is fully wikified, modified where appropriate, properly referenced etc. I don't see a problem. We do of course give preference to original articles so when there is a large backlog it is not unreasonable to reject articles which consist wholly of cut-and-pasted PD text. Gatoclass (talk) 15:15, 7 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

If they are good enough for FA, I don't see why they shouldn't be good enough for DYK. I absolutely disagree. FA and DYK evaluate completely different things. There are lots of articles that qualify for FA but not for DYK. cmadler (talk) 18:37, 7 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Right, the idea is to encourage the creation of new articles that are actually new. Cutting and pasting a hunk of public domain text (which, I confess, I have done with proper notification for a few NASA administrator articles--none submitted to DYK) is little better than splitting content from an existing Wikipedia article to create a "new" article. In either case, while a red link may have been turned blue no genuinely new content has been created. - Dravecky (talk) 20:43, 7 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

What is "genuinely new"? Every article is just a new presentation of content already existing somewhere else in reliable sources. DYK exists to encourage content that is new to Wikipedia, I see no reason to discourage users who might want to create a new article from perfectly good PD text - and I might add I think it a bad idea to insist text is rewritten as it basically only increases the probability of introducing errors into the finished product. Gatoclass (talk) 11:49, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Duel at Lake Merced

off-topic discussion. rʨanaɢ (talk) 21:57, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

It is an interesting topic. A few days ago I wrote an article Duel at Lake Merced. I used 3 public domain sources from which I copied and pasted the text into the article, and I believe at least 3 other sources to include more info to the article. Then I went to the place of the duel, and took the image. I spent 40 minutes working with it in photo shop specially for this article. I did include all public domain books and other sources I used in the reference section.At the article's talk page I specified that I copied and pasted the public domain text. I've done lot's of research, found information from 6 different sources, and ... was severely attacked at the article's talk page. It was an interesting article, illustrated with 2 public domain images (both uploaded by me) yet I asked this article to be deleted because of that unwarranted attack at the talk page. Did I do something wrong, when I copied and pasted the text from PD sources into the article, and if I did not, could this article be DYK, if it is restored? Thanks.--Mbz1 (talk) 06:09, 8 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Unwinding the proper attribution of the quoted/paraphrased text plus the severe copyedit required to address grammar and plagiarism concerns would keep a merely restored article from the front page. Perhaps if you were to rewrite the article in your own words, properly attributing sources of facts and quoted text, and create this as a new article in the future it would be addressed at that time. Also, I'm concerned by the obvious but unlabelled photo-manipulation of your photograph of the obelisks. That artwork isn't actually present at the site, is it? - Dravecky (talk) 06:44, 8 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I uploaded it to wikipedia File:The place of the duel between Broderick and Terry .jpg. I used my own image, and another PD image File:Duel between Broderick and Terry.jpg as it specified in the image description "I (Mbz1 (talk)) created this work entirely by myself using my own image and public domain image File:Duel between Broderick and Terry.jpg" So I am not sure why do you call it "unlabelled" but you may delete it of course. There's no need for the image with no article.--Mbz1 (talk) 06:52, 8 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I would ask that if the article is restored more or less in the condition it was in when it was deleted that the talk page be restored as well. I think Dravecky has well captured the concerns with the deleted text here, which has since been restored to the original editor's userspace.Bali ultimate (talk) 02:14, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Unless the article meets CSD, it should be restored. Editors can't revoke their contributions just because they're upset. rʨanaɢ (talk) 13:01, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The deletion was requested in a fit of pique. But it was still the right course of action. There was extensive plagiarism, but with subtle changes in wording and the blending together of different info from old sources that would make it very, very difficult to untangle.Bali ultimate (talk) 14:28, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

A few day ago User:Bali ultimate did not like one, two comments I made on AN/I, so he wikihounded me to the article I wrote, and wrote a rude, and very unhelpful rant at the article's talk page. That rant did upset me, but it probably should have not because as my favorite philosopher Eric Hoffer said: “Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength”. He blamed me in Plagiarism, but it was a lie because at the article's talk page I clearly specified that I copied and pasted the text from the source book into the article, and I did it before User:Bali ultimate ever showed up there. Now User:Bali ultimate wikihounded me here. The bottom line is that I, and as it is seen from this thread, not only I, did not know what is ok and not ok in treating public domain texts. I saw my images that were released in PD being used all over the net without any attributions to me, and I thought it is what PD license is about. I of course attributed all the sources I used in the references. I will re-write the article according to the advises I got from user:Dravecky and user:Rlevse.--Mbz1 (talk) 15:28, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

No you didn't. The deleted talk page spoke for itself. You mixed and matched, fiddled badly with tenses and articles, and it was a largely plagiarized piece. I'll be keeping on eye on the plagiarism issue if and when you put the new story up.Bali ultimate (talk) 20:39, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I did, and yes the talk page speaks for itself, and also for your rudeness. Just stop wikihounding me. Mind your own business, and better keep an eye on your own civility problem. --Mbz1 (talk) 21:29, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

That's enough, guys. This discussion has nothing to do about DYK anymore, so why don't you take it to one of your userspaces (or, better yet, just let it go entirely). rʨanaɢ (talk) 21:57, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Edit protected

The Taurus-Littrow hook in Queue 1 should read: ...that the mountains surrounding the Taurus-Littrow valley, the landing site of Apollo 17 on the Moon, are higher than the Grand Canyon is deep? This was the version that was approved. Thanks, Tyrol5 [Talk] 22:26, 6 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Quick reaction needed

Economy of Beijing has just been placed on the main page. It was entirely written by the multiple blocked sockpuppet User:Causeplot767. Withdraw this hook from the MP? Materialscientist (talk) 12:17, 7 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I say yesVictuallers (talk) 12:32, 7 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

... that Beijing is home to 26 Fortune Global 500 companies, the third most in the world behind Tokyo and Paris?

Replaced the above hook. If there is a motion, it can be placed in queues later. Materialscientist (talk) 12:39, 7 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Err. G5ed the article per WP:BAN, specifically "Editors are only site-banned as a last resort, usually for extreme or very persistent problems that have not been resolved by lesser sanctions and that often resulted in considerable disruption or stress to other editors. A ban is not merely a request to avoid editing "unless they behave". The measure of a site ban is that even if the editor were to make good edits, permitting them to re-join the community poses enough risk of disruption, issues, or harm, that they may not edit at all, even if the edits seem good" NativeForeigner ^Talk/_Contribs 06:06, 8 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Other opinions welcome of course. If consensus is to restore it that's fine, but I'm fairly convinced it's a G5 case. NativeForeigner ^Talk/_Contribs 06:08, 8 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Two suicides in q5

Queue 5 has two people who killed themselves. At least one too many, imo. Take one of the many opera singers, smile. And please look at the Special occasions Bach cantata, same procedure as every week, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:48, 8 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, Queue 5 is somewhat badly put together. It also has three articles on churches plus one on a monastary. Is it a Christian anniversary of some sort? GeeJo ^(t)⁄_(c) • 20:50, 8 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Diluted a bit. Materialscientist (talk) 03:16, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Need some help with bickering at the Joseph Kerman DYK nomination

Could someone please review my Joseph Kerman DYK nomination? It's currently being used by two editors as a secondary front for this rather ill-tempered discussion at Talk:Tosca, not for assessing the nomination itself. There are already 2000+ characters worth of bickering from them and no end in sight. {{{SIGH}}} Voceditenore (talk) 16:32, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

What's Dan up to now? Probably says that Kernan isn't notable. Well, as I was involved in the Tosca discussion, I'm not going to get involved. Geez. --Wehwalt (talk) 17:13, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

It's OK, Rlevse and Rjanag rode to the rescue and mighty fast too. Many thanks! Voceditenore (talk) 17:59, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

No problem. — Rlevse • Talk • 19:59, 9 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Prep 2 nom for USCGC Point Arden (WPB-82309)

USCGC Point Arden (WPB-82309) (created Sept 1) was nominated for DYK and passed and put into Prep 2 with the hook: "... that the USCGC Point Arden, an 82-foot USCG Point class cutter originally designated as WPB-82301, later acquired the name Point Caution when the Coast Guard started naming all cutters longer than 65 feet?"

Now, obviously, the Point Arden couldn't have been named Point Caution, and the designation in the hook also doesn't tally with the article name. This appears to be the result of an error in the article. However, the hook was passed.

I've checked USCGC Point Caution (WPB-82301), also created Sept 1, and it appears to pass DYK criteria. This would appear to be the article that fits the hook nominated. I have therefore put in the right article in the hook. However, the article wasn't formally nominated for DYK, so I'm asking for comments. Strange Passerby (talk) 02:09, 10 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Good catch. Seems a common sense fix too. — Rlevse • Talk • 02:12, 10 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Q4 hook 7 redundancy

"... that in the series finale to The Bill, called "Respect", all 17 current cast members appeared in the final episode?"

"Series finale" and "final episode" are redundant. Suggest "... that all 17 current cast members made appearances in "Respect", the series finale of The Bill?" Strange Passerby (talk) 05:15, 10 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Then again, "current" seems wrong now that the show has been cancelled. Strange Passerby (talk) 05:21, 10 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Corrected, removing "current", but it is still not crystal clear, as it assumes we know that those 17 are cast members of the whole series. Materialscientist (talk) 05:24, 10 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps the phrasing "then-current" would do the trick. - Dravecky (talk) 06:40, 10 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Links to disambiguation pages

The fifth hook of Queue 2 links to the dab page Ragusa. I'm too tired to investigate which is the correct disambiguation.
The eighth hook of Queue 5 links to the disambiguation page Japanese. I would recommend removing the link, or if you must have it, make it [[Japan]]ese.

MANdARAX • XAЯAbИAM 07:12, 10 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I've updated the hook in Q5 as you suggested but after several minutes of picking through the various "Ragusa" choices, I'm no closer to being able to pick the right article. It was sloppy for it to be promoted like this but, now that it's done, either the original author needs to be contacted (the link in the article also points to the disambiguation page) or the link (not the hook, just that one link) needs to be pulled for further study. - Dravecky (talk) 12:12, 10 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The Ragusa was Dubrovnik, which is the primary meaning of "Ragusa" and also the only city named Ragusa actually to have a seaport. I corrected the hook. Ucucha 12:19, 10 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

help... wait, perhaps...

Hey, the "Children of the Stars" hook has a wonderfully excellent and extremely eye catching and super-cute photo (no offense, but much better than the image currently beside that section of the queue)... I am communicating with the director of the film and we are trying to work out problems. His email server bounced his attempt to email OTRS; he is gonna retry using his personal email address etc. All of this is gonna take a while; probably a few days. Can wait without losing spot in queue...? • Ling.Nut

I personally really like the portrait in the queue and would prefer not to replace it. I am happy to move your nom back to the suggestion page to give you time to add a photo nom, but make no gaurantees that it will be selected. Your hook of course will eventually be in the queue either way.4meter4 (talk) 12:15, 10 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

You like the guy in the white wig? Really? <blink, blink>. OK. Anyhow. Yes, please move mine back. I am trying to work on image issues. Thanks. • Ling.Nut 12:20, 10 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

@@ Line 179: / Line 179: @@
 * Hey, the "Children of the Stars" hook has a wonderfully excellent and extremely eye catching and super-cute photo (no offense, but much better than the image currently beside that section of the queue)... I am communicating with the director of the film and we are trying to work out problems. His email server bounced his attempt to email OTRS; he is gonna retry using his personal email address etc. All of this is gonna take a while; probably a few days. Can wait without losing spot in queue...? &bull;&nbsp;[[User:Ling.Nut|Ling.Nut]]
 :I personally really like the portrait in the queue and would prefer not to replace it. I am happy to move your nom back to the suggestion page to give you time to add a photo nom, but make no gaurantees that it will be selected. Your hook of course will eventually be in the queue either way.[[User:4meter4|4meter4]] ([[User talk:4meter4|talk]]) 12:15, 10 September 2010 (UTC)
+:: You like the guy in the white wig? Really? <blink, blink>. OK. Anyhow. Yes, please move mine back. I am trying to work on image issues. Thanks. &bull;&nbsp;[[User:Ling.Nut|Ling.Nut]] 12:20, 10 September 2010 (UTC)