Talk:Andrew Wells

Anti-Geekdom Whipping Boy?

Another, more controversial aspect of Andrew's character is his overtly geeky behaviour and attitude. On "Buffy", the character constantly makes geeky references to comic books and Star Wars. On more than one occasion, Andrew also acts as a sort of sounding board for questions often brought up regarding the show, asking out loud why only girls get to be vampire slayers and making comments about the convoluted nature of Dawn Summers.

The bulk of the time Andrew is insulted, mocked, and ridiculed by Buffy and her friends for these outburst of geeky behavior (though on at least one occasion Xander Harris gets caught up in discussing comic books with Andrew), to the point that the character has become a whipping boy for the show's writers to mock nerd culture. Many fans feel highly insulted by this treatment of Andrew, arguing that the treatment of Andrew by the main characters violates one of the core elements of the show, by having the main characters turn into the same sort of elitist bullies that the show regularly criticized during its early seasons. The show's writers make clear, however, that they regard Andrew and his geekiness with great affection, and as a reflection of their own geekiness, in audio commentary on the "Buffy" DVD sets. Some fans laugh off these claims acknowledging that the show is not trying to send a message across about geeks.

No Bullying

At the bottom of the page (Ed Note: I've moved the section to the top of this talk page Xiner 01:20, 23 February 2006 (UTC)), it talks about how fans were upset with the treatment of Andrew, claiming that Buffy and her friends had transformed into the very people they used to mock. However, I don't see it that way. They mistreated him because he was a former enemy and they still didn't trust him. By the end, they treated him better; he was even training to be a watcher by the time he showed up on Angel (TV series). --Radaar 22:21, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, doesn't seem a very NPOV section of the article... MentAl 04:37, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

I agree. The First even asked Andrew why he alone needed to prove he had changed, while the likes of Willow were easily welcomed back to the fold. Well, Andrew had no known history of doing good. Xiner 01:16, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

Andrew Cheered The Show Up

The section “Not bullying” stands to reason at some point and the fans who didn’t like Andrew being put down by the main characters in the Buffy show may still have a point. All the pop culture items that Andrew talked so much about are art, no matter how disregarded they are, but if he had chosen to talk about classical figures of the mythologies from the past –like Greece’s- he would’ve been regarded as boring and stuffy.

Talking can be a complex problem, so using Andrew instead as the comic element was a good idea. I myself stopped watching the show by the 4th season because it had become very dramatic, very different from the fresh (although highly ironic as well) show of the first seasons. But after having my own issues I started appreciating drama and watched the show again. Yet, humor was still necessary; Xander and Willow were still a bit comic, but they simply changed with time after facing so many issues. All in all, the writers did a good job shaping Xander’s and Willow’s personalities over time, and Andrew (at least for me) was a great replacement.

When Andrew explained the general public the general situation of the 7th season in “Storyteller”, people could either see him as pathetic or funny and real. He simply expressed himself like a normal teenager (or anybody in fact) speaks in public, doubtful, hesitating, mumbling, still funny without mocking at anyone else as most comedians do, at least since the times of Miguel de Cervantes Saavedra 4 centuries ago. Yes, his innocence or naivety was funny.

PS: Yes, Andrew and Jonathan did sleep together in Mexico, no sex explicit, but slightly implicit when he smiles he sees Jonathan jumping from the bed. Regardless what he actually was, Andrew was one of my favorite characters (above Buffy)User:quin 07:00, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

Homosexuality

I watched every episode of the show, and I must admit I did not find Andrew gay at all. Okay, he was feminine, but there are such men who are nevertheless heterosexual. I thought Warren simply took advantage of Andrew's tendency to follow and not his orientation, but no one has questioned the assertion here, so I'll grudgingly accept the possibility that I missed something. Still, there should be references to specific scenes to back up the assertion, IMO. It's good practice anyway. Xiner 01:16, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

I thought that his behavior towards Spike (particularly during his guest appearances in Angel) was the strongest indication that he might have had some gay tendencies, but I honestly don't think that it really meant anything, particularly since in The Girl in Question he went out with a hot chick on each arm. I think that he merely had some feminime behaviorisms, and that his affectionate actions merely showed his sincere intentions to become a part of the "good" guys and show loyalty. There were scenes where he and Jonathan (in Mexico, I believe) slept in bed together, and it seemed pretty clear that nothing happened, that they were close friends who shared a bed out of necessity. I thought that he looked up to Warren as a leader and mentor, but didn't see that Warren had any particularly sexual power over him. The Scott Bakula reference was just funny, but can't a dude appreciate another dude without being gay? Tambourineman 17:23, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

-Andrew's "Homosexuality"-

'member, there's isn't just heterosexual or homosexual. Some people, ahem, "play both sides of the field." I remember watching those episodes and wondering myself if he wasn't homosexual or bisexual. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Casyle (talk • contribs) 07:33, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

Some of it seems to border on original research, but it's quite well-courced, I must admit. LeaHazel : talk : contribs 18:55, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Should there be some mention of the coincidence that Andrew is apparently a "friend of Judy" (ie gay) and summoned flying monkeys to the school? I read it on a fan site, so it's not been confirmed by Mutant Enemy, but it's quite a cool little piece of trivia. Paul730 22:12, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

Andrew and Sections

First off, I see no problem with the characters mocking Andrew. He -did- kill Jonathan, a person they valued very much. There was also the many, many torments he participated in putting the Scoobies, paticularly Buffy, through. I see the mocking of his geekery as a way to take it out on him 'safely'.

Secondly, the Romantic Interestes/Sexuallity sections could, at the bare minimum, be folded into each other. So much of one repeats in the other.

Lots42 09:10, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

Have just done that. And when did the Scoobies ever value Jonathan? Paul730 22:09, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

You're right, I screwed up a little there, they certainly got pissed off at him for being part of the demonic trio. But Jonathan did help Buffy defeat Warren when Warren was all nuts with the power of his magic balls. And earlier, the Scoobies saved Jonathan from death once or thrice. The time Jonathan became a 'Superstar' and Buffy even talked him out of commiting suicide.

Lots42 09:23, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Tucker

I could be remembering wrong, but wasn't Tucker the younger brother while Andrew was older? --74.171.62.47 20:26, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Andrew specifically called Tucker his older brother, IIRC. -- Noneofyourbusiness (talk) 01:17, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Longwayhomeandrew.jpg

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BetacommandBot 11:07, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Hugging Warren

Right now the article says that when Willow turns into Warren (The Killer In Me) Andrew "rushes to hug his friend" or similar. It never occurred to me that maybe Andrew is trying to hug Warren, it totally seemed to me that Andrew is either attacking Warren or just totally freaked out that Warren is appearing. At that point in the series Andrew has realized that Warren was actually the First and he is trying to become one of Buffy's gang and to reject his evil side (even though the episode appears before "Storyteller"). Anyone else have thoughts? I was going to just take that out but does everyone else think that Andrew is trying to hug Warren? Phoebeheyman (talk) 19:39, 10 June 2008 (UTC)

Original Research Is Bad

Speculating on Andrew's sexuallity via flimsy evidence is just going to be deleted sooner or later, people. That kind of stuff belongs on a fan site, not Wikipedia. Lots42 (talk) 05:36, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

Agreed. I think I was the one who added a bunch of that stuff in the first place, before I was more aware of policy. I've removed the cruft, but it can still be found at the Buffyverse Wiki, if anyone's looking for it.  Paul  730 11:25, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

Just a minor thought

I think it's noteable for the character that Andrew's 'sauveness' with the Slayers just keeps going up. He's far, far less of a geek then he was on the show. I'm just not sure how to add this in without it being OR. Lots42 (talk) 21:20, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

It is pure OR and is not worth mentioning. It is however worth mentioning and not OR to say that he has been fully accepted by the Scooby Gang. kingdom2 (talk) 22:30, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

??? Andrew losing his rampaging geekiness (and gaining the abillity to socialize) is a very important aspect of his character and should be noted. Somehow. While following guidelines of course. Lots42 (talk) 10:56, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

He didn't lose his rampaging geekiness! He talked Buffy's ear off the whole way to Italy on geek-related topics. The only real difference between his behavior now and when he was on the show is that now people don't hold hostility or immediately disregard him because of recent evilness. He's "matured", but not by much. Again, though, it is still 100% pure OR without some kind of source other than the comic itself, as what you are proposing is evaluative, whereas what I said in my previous edit was taken almost directly out of the comic's last line. kingdom2 (talk) 22:53, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

We both agree that he matures and socializes better. We both agree that if the information is added in, it should be done so under Wikipedia guidelines. Why is this discussion continuing? We -agree-. Lots42 (talk) 13:40, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

So we do nothing? kingdom2 (talk) 17:39, 16 April 2009 (UTC)