Talk:Jaiyah Saelua

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Out magazine article

If anyone wants to use it to add some more stuff to the encyclopedia entry, link here. Abeg92contribs 13:57, 4 July 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Fa'afafine or just a transwoman?

There seems to be conflict. As far as anyone interested knows, fa'afafine are a Samoan type of bigender people (between male and female) that, while typically leaning toward supreficial masculine characteristics, does not fit binary model of gender... yet the article also notes a (well-sourced!) gender transition, an odd for a intersex/non-binary person. There seems to be no info about pronouns on either Jaiyah's Facebook or Instagram, so, until clarification, pronouns are changed to they (please don't use that for anything else in article as a compromise. stupid english language). 82.139.58.105 (talk) 21:35, 31 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Her pronouns are listed here, in this article: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/aug/01/footballs-first-faafafine-trans-rights-trailblazer-jaiyah-saelua-on-stardom-and-sisterhood . Please stop erasing her gender just because she trans. Thanks. 24.141.118.159 (talk) 05:55, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

As a follow-up, she calls herself a trans woman in this article: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/aug/29/jaiyah-saelua-transgender-footballer-interview. Do not edit trans people's pages if you can't be bothered to do very basic research. The information you requested was linked in this very article that you chose to butcher. If you want to delete a trans person's pronouns, you need to provide substantial evidence for doing so. Don't bulldoze into trans articles. There was no conflict in this article. You should ask questions in the talk page rather than taking inappropriate and unilateral action when you clearly are unfamiliar with the subject at hand. Otherwise all you're doing is creating harm and spreading transphobia. Stop it. 24.141.118.159 (talk) 07:57, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

She/her pronouns

Jaiyah appears to use she/her pronouns. Those are the pronouns used for her in every news article that references her. Furthermore, this very article specifically says she was declared "woman of the match." While she is fa'afafine, she has regularly described herself as a trans woman. These are complimentary, not contradictory, identities. This article by the Guardian, for instance, lays that out: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/aug/01/footballs-first-faafafine-trans-rights-trailblazer-jaiyah-saelua-on-stardom-and-sisterhood .

It's not right that trans women have to constantly prove their gender or else cis editors on this site revert to they/them status. Particularly when the evidence for her gender is listed *in this very article* it just comes off as incredibly transphobic. Cis pages are not filled with demands for mountains of evidence of someone's gender. Stop deleting her pronouns. I've edited this article to revert her pronouns back to before some other contributor edited it. If you want to change her pronouns to they/them, you should provide substantial evidence for it. They/them pronouns are not a compromise. 24.141.118.159 (talk) 06:07, 21 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

And yet he plays for the men's team... 2A0B:6204:34C8:AF00:382F:A8B0:3773:C60F (talk) 11:37, 3 February 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Birth name?

Requesting consensus on this. I added Jaiyah's birth name back to the article as:

- it was removed by an editor with three total Wiki edits at that time, that claimed it was "confusing", without discussion

- it has been used by sources that I believe count as reliable, including 11v11 (https://www.11v11.com/matches/fiji-v-american-samoa-15-may-2004-253168/), this FIFA profile that is cited in the article at the moment (https://web.archive.org/web/20071226124608/http://www.fifa.com/worldfootball/statisticsandrecords/players/player=213295/index.html), the New York Times (https://web.archive.org/web/20210211221651/https://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/24/sports/soccer/american-samoa-winless-and-ranked-last-earns-victory-in-a-world-cup-qualifier.html), etc

- it was used in the film Next Goal Wins, which Saelua herself has promoted, suggesting at least some level of acceptance of it

I do not think it is difficult to write an article that mentions a trans person's former name, especially one that they don't seem intent on burying. Plenty of other articles do this, even in the sporting space (Quinn etc). Additionally, the initial edit was made without consultation for a reason that does not hold water. Even if it is decided not to include her former name, surely there is a better reason than "it's confusing" - it's not! Toffeenix (talk) 02:52, 4 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]