Jump to content

英文维基 | 中文维基 | 日文维基 | 草榴社区

Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2013 September 22

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

September 22

[edit]

Category:American Horseracing Trophies

[edit]
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:55, 3 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Rename. To fix capitalization and spacing. Another option is merge to Category:American horse racing awards. Tassedethe (talk) 21:28, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Movies in Nepal Bhasa

[edit]
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename. Good Ol’factory (talk) 21:10, 1 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Rename. Per the convention of Category:Films by language. Another option is merge to Category:Nepali-language films. Tassedethe (talk) 20:17, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Canadian musicians missing province or territory

[edit]
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: keep. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:56, 3 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: These are miscellany categories for articles about musicians and musical groups that do not indicate the province or territory from which the musician or group originated. However, as in any case of subcategorization, these articles should remain in their respective parent categories until individiual items can be moved into appropriate subcategories. WikiProject Canadian music may choose to separately track this characteristic on the talk pages of relevant articles, using their project banner, but in this case I don't see how that would be better than simply monitoring and diffusing Category:Canadian musicians and Category:Canadian musical groups. -- Black Falcon (talk) 19:34, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Note: WikiProject Canadian music has been notified using {{Cfd-notify}}. -- Black Falcon (talk) 19:34, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • keep these are hidden categories, and are cleanup categories, so I don't really see why we should delete them. Cleanup categories can be placed into the cleanup category tree, whereas the regular categories will never be so placed. Further, the categories suggested for merging have non-province based subcategories, so not appearing in the base category does not mean it has province information attached to the article. -- 70.24.249.39 (talk) 07:29, 23 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • As noted, these are maintenance categories which are serving to help editors identify articles that need work, and are hidden to and thus non-browsable by general users. As such, there's no real reason for deletion here; since both musicians and musical groups are already subcategorized by genre anyway, these aren't precluding any category that the pages in question would otherwise be sitting in, since they would already be diffused out of the parent category on genre grounds whether the province or territory category was missing or not. That said, I was able to remove some entries by virtue of the fact that province or territory information was present in the article and just hadn't been categorized yet, or even in a couple of cases that the page was already sitting in a "by specific city" subcategory of the province or territory-level category — but these are still maintenance categories in which inclusion is meant to be temporary, and aren't interfering with anything at the content level. Keep. Bearcat (talk) 19:37, 23 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep per Bearcat. -BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:34, 24 September 2013 (UTC)----[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Basketball players from Chicago, Illinois

[edit]
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: merge to Category:Sportspeople from Chicago, Illinois and Category:Basketball players from Illinois. Good Ol’factory (talk) 21:08, 1 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Nominator's rationale: In the past we have decided specifically to not create categories for basketball players from specific cities (see Basketball Players from Oregon CFD) That discussion captures the essence so please read the discussion. My suggestion is to (re)upmerge to the 2 categories "Basketball players from Illinois" and "Sportspeople from Chicago, Illinois." Rikster2 (talk) 16:58, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep. I will have to restate what I have said before. I can understand not needing such a category for Portland and other smaller cities, but Chicago is a different story. Chicago is a much larger city and a considerably higher proportion of professional basketball players come from it. I can easily imagine someone being interested in knowing what basketball players come from Chicago. Also, Sportspeople from Chicago is a rather large category and dividing into basketball, baseball, or American football would help narrow it down. I was hoping that we could limit it to three cities: Chicago, NYC and LA.Hoops gza (talk) 17:53, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
How did you pick those three cities? Population? Media market size? Perceived top exporters of basketball players? There is no way to limit this hierarchy structure to three cities - just look at the sportspeople cats - they originally only featured major metro areas and now we have "Sportspeople from Akron, Ohio," "Sportspeople from Eugene, Oregon," etc. a category structure either exists or it doesn't, and editors cannot be blamed for assuming that a category structure that exists should be carried out further. Rikster2 (talk) 18:58, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

New scheme for Bishops in Ireland

[edit]
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: no consensus to rename/delete. Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:59, 3 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Part of a general scheme detailed in the Irish bishops talk page. To facilitate a tripartite realignment Pre-Reformation / Church of Ireland / Roman Catholic. To distinguish between bishops as the ordinaries of sees in Ireland as opposed to people of Irish nationality/heritage who have been bishops elsewhere: in Great Britain, the diaspora, the Empire, as missionaries, or in the Roman curia. To eliminate the use of "Anglican" rather than "Church of Ireland" which seems designed to gloss over the fact that the Church of Ireland regards the pre-Reformation bishops as part of its heritage; the earlier one are in effect ceded to the Roman Catholic categories. Not sure about the "in Ireland" suffix: are there any Church of Ireland archdeacons or bishops who are not in Ireland? Laurel Lodged (talk) 15:43, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Can I add to the nom (to deal with issues at one fell swoop)?
This was tagged for this nom and remains tagged, possibly due to an incomplete transclusion: the CFD was not closed. Peterkingiron (talk) 18:34, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
This is a one-child category, which will be emptied by merging that child to Category:Bishops in Ireland. The result of this will be that the two denominational foremr bishops categories are directly in the main parent, along with all the current bishoprics (or bishops). Peterkingiron (talk) 18:34, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I've added the deletion proposal to the list. However the closing admin did not allow the "Former" renames in the other nomination as there was no clear consensus. So I'd prefer that to go forward independently of this nom. Also, I think that PK is right about "in Ireland" - it's redundant. Laurel Lodged (talk) 18:42, 23 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Reply I have not notified that project, just the Ireland project. However, it is wrong to say that the name, as proposed, is "The Post-Reformation Anglican Church". The intent of the proposal was to allow for the claim of that particular Anglican Church, the Church of Ireland, to have equal claim over both sets of bishops, both pre and post the Reformation. To leave things as they stand is to cut off the Church of Ireland from pre-Reformation bishops. That ought to be avoided surely? So the name is to be read as "Bishops of the Church of Ireland dating from after the Reformation". Laurel Lodged (talk) 12:38, 24 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Reply But they're not Anglican bishops in general. That would include the episcopal churches of America, Scotland and Zambia, should they choose to re-evangelise Ireland. They are bishops of the Church of Ireland in particular. Laurel Lodged (talk) 13:27, 28 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Reply @Laurel Lodged:. There may be a case using the name of the particular Anglican denomination rather than just "Anglican". However, the current convention of Category:Anglican bishops and Category:Anglican bishops by diocese is to just use "Anglican", so that would require a wider discussion.
In the meantime, my specific objection to this category was not directly about whether to use "Anglican" or "CoI"; it was to the "Post-Reformation" construct. It's not just that we don't use that label for any other reference to the COI; it's also that when two denominations lay claim to the same heritage, we should be treating them equally. So if we were going to create Category:Post-Reformation Church of Ireland bishops, then we should have a parrallel Category:Post-Reformation Roman Catholic bishops in Ireland. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 12:11, 2 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Reply @BrownHairedGirl: But the whole idea of the new scheme is to allow both churches take the "credit" for the pre-Reformation bishops. There is no need to worry about the post-Reformation bishops. The two denominations do not lay claim to the same post-Reformation bishops. Each has its own set of post-Reformation bishops. Neither lays claim to the bishops of the other denomination. They might both claim the bishopric (see) but that's a different story. Laurel Lodged (talk) 18:29, 2 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Reply @Laurel Lodged:. There is no indeed need to worry about the post-Reformation bishops. That's precisely why I oppose the renaming. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:47, 2 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Reply @BrownHairedGirl: I'm baffled. Firstly, there is no need to create Category:Post-Reformation Church of Ireland bishops as it already exists. It just happens to have an inaccurate name at present - Category:Anglican bishops in Ireland. So if the proposal goes through, this minor defect will be remedied. Secondly, you say "we should have a parrallel Category:Post-Reformation Roman Catholic bishops in Ireland.". I entirely agree. That's why I created it some weeks ago. This seems to have escaped your attention. Now, remind me again why it is that you're opposed to your own logic? Laurel Lodged (talk) 22:32, 2 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Reply @Laurel Lodged:. I hadn't actually spotted that you had created Category:Post-Reformation Roman Catholic bishops in Ireland; I didn't suspect that anyone would be silly enough to do that, and will take it to CFD when this discussion closes.
And don't try sentence-snipping games to invert their meaning, when the original is only a few inches up the screen. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs)
Reply Reply @BrownHairedGirl: The charge of sentence snipping is unjustified I think. Your argument has been faithfully presented. I will reproduce it here again: "my specific objection to this category was ... to the "Post-Reformation" construct", "when two denominations lay claim to the same heritage, we should be treating them equally". In my previous post I pointed out that in the case of the post-Reformation bishops, the case that you mentioned simply does not arise as two denominations do not claim the same heritage. It follows therefore that your objection withers away and so should be withdrawn. And please refrain from personal attacks; confine your comments to the subject matter. The category creation was not "silly", it may be ill-advised, illogical or ungrammatical but good faith compels us to refrain from using the word "silly". It is disappointing that I should consistently have to remind an Admin about such basic good manners in discussions. Laurel Lodged (talk) 19:21, 3 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Reply Hope you are having fun with all the distortion-by-out-of-context-quote.
If you ever get bored with trying to claim that I hold I position that I don't hold and have opposed, just re-read what i wrote at the start of the thread: Two denominations lay claim to the pre-reformation bishops, so we should have a Category:Pre-reformation bishops of Foo, which would be a subcat of both Category:Anglican bishops of Foo and Category:Roman Catholic bishops of Foo.
Which part of that is unclear to you? --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:06, 3 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Reply I can't understand why you have quoted the Pre-Reformation statements. It is with the post-Reformation position that the illogicality arises. Please address the post-Reformation position that you have advanced. Laurel Lodged (talk) 21:02, 3 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Pie throwing

[edit]
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: relisted at CFD 2013 October 2. BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 13:29, 2 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Nominator's rationale: Unfocused category. Pieing and List of people who have been pied are the only obvious members; everything else is only tangentially associated with pieing at best. For instance, it's far from the main thing associated with a cream pie, or Roscoe Arbuckle, or Soupy Sales. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 11:18, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Recipients of Meritorious Service medals

[edit]
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete. Good Ol’factory (talk) 21:05, 1 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Delete per WP:OC#AWARD and WP:NOTDEFINING. Per WP:CAT Categories are meant to be defining characteristics of the topic and this category does not meet that criteria. Being that this award is widely conferred upon military members (SNCOs and O-4/5s generally) it is a non-defining characteristic, even if an individual received multiple MSMs it would not make them notable by Wikipedia standards. — -dainomite   06:10, 14 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This debate has been included in the list of Military-related deletion discussions. — -dainomite   19:38, 15 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, -- Black Falcon (talk) 04:51, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]


The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:London Loop

[edit]
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: delete. Good Ol’factory (talk) 21:04, 1 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: This category consists (apart from the synonymous-eponymous article) of articles about places (villages, woods etc) that a walking trail passes through. That a trail passes through a place is not a WP:DEFINING characteristic of that place (most of which existed long before the trail). We don't usually categorize places by which roads/railways etc pass through them (example CFD) so why should a walking trail be any different? This category also causes articles to be incorrectly (per WP:SUBCAT) categorized (e.g. Petts Wood under Category:London Borough of Enfield). For info: This category was recently included in a broad CFD nomination with a no consensus result. DexDor (talk) 04:28, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
[edit]
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:UK Crown copyright files; Category:Crown copyright files to become a container category. Note that unless/until it is renamed, Template:Non-free_Crown_copyright will now populate Category:UK Crown copyright files. Good Ol’factory (talk) 17:32, 10 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Split. This should become a container category, instead of being a use category. The files categorized here are under UK Crown copyright, and not any old crown copyright, therefore should be categorized correctly. The way it is now formatted, the subcategories for Canadian and New Zealander are incorrectly categorized, as they are not subsidiary licenses of UK Crown copyright. There's no indication these are British files-only, so this is problematic and WP:Systematic bias against any Crown copyright that isn't British. -- 70.24.249.39 (talk) 03:32, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Masjids In Kerala

[edit]
The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.
The result of the discussion was: merge. Good Ol’factory (talk) 21:02, 1 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Nominator's rationale: Merge. Masjid is just another word for mosque (it redirects there). Tassedethe (talk) 00:47, 22 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.