Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Computing/2016 August 11

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August 11

Gateway NV78 running Windows 7 Home Premium "force powers off" by itself

Twice today, and once this weekend, my computer, 2009 model described in the headline, has simply turned itself off without warning as if I have force powered it off; no log off, just CLICK! I have no apprent problem on restart, and have checked for recently installed updates, none since 8/3. I would think this might just be pending mechanical failure, but it only seems to happen when I visit sites with complex video and html setup (assuming those are the right words). That is, WP, Craig's List, Drudge, and other such simplified sites do not cause this. Sites that auto-load videos and (almost) insist on disabling adblocker do.

Is there any diagnostic I should run, or update I should look for? It seems suspicious to me that it's only the most fancy new sites that I have been visiting when this happened.

BTW, this has happened only since I installed, then removed, Windows 10, and I do have both recovery disks and a recent (7/29) repair disk, and recent disk image. And I did run chkdsk/r, which fixed a few corrupted files on 7/29.

Security Update KB3170106 was the latest update, from 8/1. Other updates are from 7/19 or earlier.

Thanks. μηδείς (talk) 00:32, 11 August 2016 (UTC)

Try memory, cpu and gpu stress tests. There are several free options of each. Vespine (talk) 02:03, 11 August 2016 (UTC)

Also, by default windows 7 is configured to automatically restart after a critical failure. You can disable this which will show you if your computer is actually Blue screening which should have some useful clues. Vespine (talk) 03:41, 11 August 2016 (UTC)

This is a good idea, but my hunch is CPU overheating. "Complex video and html" will tax the CPU. Modern CPUs are designed to automatically shut off if they get too hot. Your BIOS or UEFI might record events such as thermal shutoff in an error log, but you'll have to consult the documentation or search around for how to access it. If you haven't lately, clean the dust out of the system with some gas duster, then try stress testing. If a CPU stress test causes a shutoff, check if the CPU heatsink has come loose. --71.110.8.102 (talk) 08:20, 11 August 2016 (UTC)

A good way to test for overheating in a desktop PC is to remove the case and point a powerful box fan on high at the innards. If that solves the problem, then overheating is the issue. You can then either continue to use this workaround, or try to identify and repair the cause of the overheating, such as if the heatsink has come loose. Incidentally, this happening in August, when it's hot outside in NJ and likely warm inside, is another good reason to suspect overheating. StuRat (talk) 11:50, 11 August 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for all the help so far, especially Stu, to whom I apologize for a previous incident. The bizarre thing is, that I keep my apt at 68F, and my room at my parents (which is in NJ, and where I spend most weekends and holidays) and have a small desk fan blowing on back of the computer at all times. I check and clean the fans. I feel the case to see if it is getting overwarm, and that happens so rarely it's not worth mentioning. These last three times the computer has powered off by itself I checked for undue heat, and it was warmer than ambient, but too cool for a comfortable shower.

I have noticed inordinately high CPU usage at times. I'll run the stress tests mentioned above after dinner when I have time. Again, thanks. μηδείς (talk) 02:13, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

PS, is there some physical fault, like a bad power cord connection that might be an issue? I don't think that's the case, but I did have that with my powerbook back in 2006. μηδείς (talk) 19:47, 11 August 2016 (UTC)

Your small desk fan blowing on the back of the computer may be preventing the internal fan from doing its job. Try positioning the fan so it blows across the rear at an oblique angle that helps, rather than hinders, the internal fan. Akld guy (talk) 21:28, 11 August 2016 (UTC)

Interesting! What I actually do is have the fan blow down on the table (earthcoreward) in part to simply circulate the AIR downward in part since I have been fat since birth, and in part since its noise helps my anxiety and PTSD. (I do not want medical advice, I actually have good treatment, thanks...) but my point is that I really doubt that my prorcessor is overheating to cause this very recent problem, unless something over bodyheat is really problematic. I'd say it never gets over nodyheat, and rarely over 80F. I still have to do the stress tests. μηδείς (talk) 02:13, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

Keep in mind that any overheating problem may be extremely localized. The CPU, for example, may overheat, but when that heat is spread throughout the entire box, it's not all that much. Think of it like when you microwave some frozen food and a spot gets burnt while the rest remains frozen. StuRat (talk) 03:33, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

To clarify StuRat's answer, 80 degrees Fahrenheit or even 36 degrees C is very low for the CPU unless it isn't doing anything which your response suggests isn't the case. I don't know what temperature you are reporting, but it's fairly unlikely to be the CPU/processor. I also don't know what you mean by "I'd say". If you have a monitoring program, it shouldn't be that hard to log or graph it, so you don't need to "say", you can easily see what temperatures it reaches. Note in particular, it doesn't matter if it spents most of the time at 80 degrees Fahrenheit, if it occasionally reaches 80 degrees C that's probably enough to cause problems. If you don't have a monitoring program, "say"ing what the temperature is is meaningless. The CPU shouldn't be exposed, if it is you likely have a serious problem. Touching or measuring the CPU HSF can be useful, but it's still possible for the CPU to overheat despite the HSF being not that hot if it's making poor contact for some reason. Since CPUs have had built in thermal diodes for 10 years or more, there's no reason to to guess the temperature. Just use some program which reports it as suggested below. Nil Einne (talk)

Check for hardware problems like blown capacitors, dust and dirt on board and cooling. See also the achive. We already had discussed similar problems. Btw. I am working on a self refurbished machine. And I know, the word "refurbished" in a sales offer means "we have removed dust and dirt, only". I did a little bit more. Note, the PSU still stores hazardous voltage, even when turned of and unplugged. The best chance to discarge ist sto power up the machine, wait until fans and inicators appers and the pull the plug from the wall to discharge the PSU itself as most as possible. If one of the discharge resistors fails, his is the best way to discharge. This way of discharing fails if the machine does not startup and the capacitors remain charged, see Power supply unit (computer). --Hans Haase (有问题吗) 09:36, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

A replacement PC that is faster than what you have now will cost you $40.[1] --10:12, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

Your computer's SMBus provides information about the temperature inside the case, of the CPU, the GPU, and fan speeds (the GPU and fans might not have sensors). The standard program to show this in Linux is based on lm sensors. For MS-Windows, [2] appears to show the same information, but I've not tried it. LongHairedFop (talk) 09:02, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

How spooler error can be fix?

I have an canon printer and sometime spooler error occured and i can't fix it properly. Can you please suggest me how i fix it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wefix365 (talk • contribs) 10:36, 11 August 2016 (UTC)

Does any of this advice help ? [3] StuRat (talk) 11:44, 11 August 2016 (UTC)

Help finding numerical conversion

I have a raw file that appears to be encoding the values, and I have the output, so I can compare the two. I have found section of the file is using base64. But other sections I cannot figure out. I'm going to post the text and what the value actually represents to see if anyone can tell me how to make these conversions. The entire value contains a lot of "A"s both before and after the unique characters, so I have attempted to extract the relevant parts and could have made mistakes. For example, the full string would be ""AgAAACwBAAAAAAAA"" but only the CwB vs. OgD part changes between that and "AgAAAOgDAAAAAAAA".

ACACUU=2000 JqZBUI=33,6 JqZGT8=0,6 HsUrj0=0,060 D8=0,50 OgD=1000 CwB=300

DO any of these numbers make sense in the context of the character strings?

Thanks, -199.66.168.59 (talk) 18:30, 11 August 2016 (UTC)

Your attempt to extract "relevant" parts has made this much more difficult. It would be important to know in exactly what position within the string of A's your shorter strings appear. Are all the strings 16 characters as in your two full examples? Do they all start with "Ag" which you've also omitted? And what do the commas mean in the decimal values? Are those decimal points, so that "0,50" means 1/2? But then it's puzzling why two of the non-integral values have trailing zeros and the other two don't. The first obvious guess is these are some kind of floating point or fixed point format in some large base, where the A's represent zeros and the other characters represent other digits, but it's pretty hard to guess from the information you've provided. I'd suggest you post some examples without omitting anything, and explain more unambiguously what the "actual values" are. CodeTalker (talk) 00:18, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

OK. This is European so ,=. for you Americans.

• "CAAAAACACUUAAAAA"=2000 (0...5000) or (0...100000)
• "CAAAAJqZmT8AAAAA"=1.20 (0.00...2.00)
• "CAAAAAAAAEAAAAAA"=2.00 (0.00...2.00)
• "CAAAAHsUrj0AAAAA"=0.060 (0.000...1.000)
• "CAAAAAAAAD8AAAAA"=0.50 (0.00...1.00)
• "CAAAAAAAgD8AAAAA"=1.00 (0.00...1000.00)
• "AgAAAOgDAAAAAAAA"=1000 (0...1000000)
• "AgAAACwBAAAAAAAA"=300 (0...86400)

I've added the ranges the values are looking for, so perhaps there is some decimal point ignoring and that decimal is added after the fact. We also have values like "BgAAAAAAAAAAAAAA" that relate to a drop down menu choice and ""CgAAAAEAAAAAAAAA" that relate to a 1 bit binary value of 1 (all As equals 0). And finally the D prefix seems to indicate Base64 after the 16 character string. -199.66.168.59 (talk) 15:03, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

These strings too are base64. The first 4 bytes are a little-endian type code: 8 in all these cases except for 2 in the last two. It might be the length of the following field, although 2 bytes wouldn't store the upper limits you mention for the last fields and none of the fields have any bits set in what would be the high 4 bytes. The last two are simple little-endian integers of the given values. The others are more difficult: note that 2.0 has a single bit set, but 0.5 and 1.0 do not, and that 1.0 has a bit set in a position lower than the lowest bit set for 0.5. --Tardis (talk) 16:39, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

The others are just single precision numbers, but some of your values are only approximate: the true first and fourth values are 2200 and 0.085. I was misled by the single-bit 2, thinking that it meant an integer encoding was in use (with perhaps a separate fractional part), but because of the exponent bias it happens to be the only number ${}>1$ with a single bit set in the floating-point format (single or double!) as well. --Tardis (talk) 18:42, 14 August 2016 (UTC)