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Talk:Battle of Ismailia

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Good articleBattle of Ismailia has been listed as one of the Warfare good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Did You Know Article milestones
DateProcessResult
April 16, 2011Good article nomineeListed
June 12, 2011WikiProject A-class reviewApproved
July 18, 2013Peer reviewReviewed
Did You Know A fact from this article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the "Did you know?" column on March 23, 2011.
The text of the entry was: Did you know ... that when the ceasefire was issued to end the Battle of Ismailia, some Israeli paratroopers and Egyptian Sa'iqa found that they were no more than 20 meters apart?
Current status: Good article

GA Review

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Battle of Ismailia/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Harrison49 (talk) 18:28, 16 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)
  1. It is reasonably well written.
    a (prose): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
    The article is well written and follows the correct style.
  2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.
    a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):
    The article is well referenced.
  3. It is broad in its coverage.
    a (major aspects): b (focused):
    The article covers the major events of the battle and is focused.
  4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.
    Fair representation without bias:
    The article follows a neutral point of view.
  5. It is stable.
    No edit wars, etc.:
    The article does not appear to be affected by any edit warring.
  6. It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate.
    a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
    Images are used well and freely licensed through public domain ruling.
  7. Overall:
    Pass/Fail:
    A very interesting read, and now a Good Article too. Harrison49 (talk) 19:56, 16 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Egyptian strategic victory ?

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While the article covers the combat from 18/10 to 22/10, the described result of this battle, “Egyptian tactical and strategic victory”, ignores the Israeli advancements prior to 22/10. On 22/10 the Israelis were halted south to the Cairo - Ismailia road, but they made advancements before 22/10 and succeeded to capture Serapeum. Eventually, the Israeli positions of 22/10 were norther than those of 18/10. I am not sure the the Egyptian victory on 22/10 had such high value. On the article, it is already mentioned that Israeli bombardments have made the Cairo - Ismailia road unusable for wheeled vehicles, so capturing the road area was not so necessary. For the total isolation of the 2nd field army, and its cutting from all supply measures via land, like tracked vehicle, the Israeli had to push north and reach the Mediterranean, so capturing the Cairo - Ismailia road was not enough. However, it is not mentioned whether there were large stocks of supplies in Ismailia like those that were in Suez. If there were such stocks on Ismailia, and Ismailia would being captured by the Israelis, the 2nd field army would lose a lot of supplies. In that case, an Egyptian victory would be significant. Megaidler (talk) 16:15, 27 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

As far as I understand, Ismailia was Second Army's main supply base, and major supply routes on the way to Second Army from Cairo passed through Ismailia. Its capture basically meant Second Army would be faced with a similar encirclement to Third Army or would be forced to retreat across the canal. To that end, the Israelis wanted to capture Ismailia, and the Egyptians wanted to defend it at all costs. According to the sources used, the end result of the battle is that the Israelis failed to capture Ismailia; a tactical and strategic victory for the Egyptians. Dupuy mentions that the road was made unusable by artillery, but that doesn't mean the significance of the Egyptian victory was lesser, unless a source explicitly says otherwise. --Sherif9282 (talk) 17:23, 27 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]
In 67 the Israelis planned to capture the entire Sinai peninsula but failed to capture Port Fouad, and no one questions their victory back than. During the battles described on the article the Israelis made advancements in comparison to their initial position on 18/10. All sources claims that the Israelis tried and failed to capture Ismailia, no doubt. There is no doubt that Ismailia was a place of much more significance than Serapeum, or Port Fouad. However, the whole supply transportation for the 2nd army was not dependent on the identity of the army that holds that road according to 2 sourced brought by Sherif9282. Even Ismailia was a main of supply base, receiving supplies from the Nile area, and sending supplies to all divisions of the 2nd army, Dupuy and O'ballanceclaims claimed that the Cairo – Ismailia road was unusable due to Israeli artillery. Wheeled vehicles couldn't reach Ismailia through that road because the Israelis did block it - by heavy bombardments. It seems that Dupuy and O'ballanceclaims gave less significance to the Israeli encirclement of the 3rd Army as well as to Egyptian maintaining of the Cairo - Ismailia road. Only one source used the term “strategic” for describing the Egyptian success on 22/10 and it is Gawrych:
A combined Egyptian commando and paratrooper force, for example, registered a tactical victory of strategic import by stopping Sharon's repeated attempts to capture Ismailia, whose loss would have seriously imperiled the logistical lifeblood to the Second Army.
He even didn't use the term “strategic victory”. The use of this term was Sherif's decision only and it is WP:Puffery. I am expecting Sherif to qoute the exact words of Dupuy and O'ballanceclaims regarding the situation of the Cairo – Ismailia main road. Megaidler (talk) 20:31, 27 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]
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