Talk:Trident (software)

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On 23 October 2022, it was proposed that this article be moved. The result of the discussion was not moved.

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On 01 Nov 2010, [http://www.com/

06:50, 8 Nov 2010 (UTC)

Version list?

Does anyone have a source for the version list that was added here by User:81.86.99.54? I can't remember Microsoft using roman numerals for version numbers on any other software. AlistairMcMillan 14:32, 1 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Twenty days later, no response. I've pulled the version list. I'd like to add it back, but I can't find any sources for this information. AlistairMcMillan 01:38, 21 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

You are right that Microsoft has never used roman numerals officially, but when Trident is mentioned by members of the IE team in discussion groups the employees /may/ refer to it as "Trident IV" or "Trident 4", however they generally just refer to it as just plain ol' "Trident". To quote Dave Massy, from the IE dev team:

Actually thinking about it I guess we are on "Trident IV"

IE4 - Trident I IE5.0 - Trident II IE5.5 - Trident III - There were more enhancements in IE5.5 than many people realised. Although we only called it a .5 release, for Trident it had more enhancements than some other releases. IE6 - Trident IV

So now we are working on "Trident V" but generally we refer to it just as Trident and the version of IE that it shipped with rather than the version of Trident.

Thanks -Dave

See his post about it here: http://channel9.msdn.com/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=37800#37800

Since that post doesn't actually support the claim that anyone has _ever been using_ the terms "Trident IV", "Trident V" and so on, but rather Dave Massey is saying that the nomenclature is a reasonable one, the roman numeral versions have not been supported by evidence of use from "reliable sources". In line with Wikipedia's policies about information needing to be verifiable I am deleting these version numbers, which in any case do not add anything to the rest of the article.83.105.29.229 (talk) —Preceding undated comment was added at 10:42, 29 November 2008 (UTC).[reply]

Bug in HTML.DLL 6.0

There's a critical flaw in the newest version of HTML.DLL, distributed via the Optional section of Windows Update . The flaw is in its Dll export function. If you register this version of the DLL all embedded HTML functions within Windows will cease to work (System , Internet Explorer,). Do register version 6.0.2900.2838. The previous version, 6.0., is not affected. If version 6.0 was registered, cthe 6.0 version to windows\system32

Internet Explorer

[http://wikipedia.org/

HTML

"HTML" 19:47, 17 March 2011 (UTC)

version IE8

the version that IE8  Should we go by the file version or the IE8 US string, which says 4.0

02:10, 29 August 2011 (UTC)

html

is the support HTML

microsoft 66.157.20.5 (talk) 19:01, 25 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Mac

I see that Mac is quoted as being supported by Trident. That is rubbish - the layout engine was called Tasman for IE/Mac. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.47.189.167 (talk) 16:47, 20 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed. EVula // talk // ☯ // 17:26, 5 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

IE1~3

I have 3 questions to ask:

What's the layout engine of IE1~3?
What's the layout engine of IE for Unix?
Is Trident the official name? What does the name comes from?

Thank you everyone for help! --虞海 (Yú Hǎi) (talk) 08:37, 8 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

on the start of the application there was nothing what is able to be called layout engine
same as above
It is the official name (search for the ieblog on msdn)

mabdul 11:33, 8 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

For IE1-2, Microsoft licensed Mosaic (web browser) from the NCSA and just rebranded it as a different browser. The article for Internet Explorer 3 is less clear about its engine, but from what I can tell, I was not Trident, and not Mosaic.
See Internet Explorer for UNIX, which says that IE UNIX did use a ported Trident for its final versions.
Trident is the official name, but I'm not sure where it came from. It's been used since 1997, possibly earlier.

--Gyrobo (talk) 16:50, 8 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

how do you pronounce trident?

just wondering :) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.168.36.64 (talk) 10:35, 29 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

[ˈtraɪd(ə)nt] by Bing Dictionary. -- Sky6t (talk) 05:41, 9 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

What about QQ?

Doesn't Tencent QQ render the advertisement bar and group info with Trident? Sky6t (talk) 05:41, 9 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

RealNetworks is a company, not an application

RealNetworks is listed as an application that utilizes Trident, however RealNetworks is a company with a variety of different published software applications, so this is likely incorrect. It is possible some versions of RealPlayer use the engine, but I cannot find documentation to support this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.11.70.194 (talk) 20:35, 9 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 23 October 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. (non-admin closure) Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 15:10, 8 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Trident (software) → ? – What should the name of this article be? The editing history shows it's been both Trident and MSHTML. I don't have a preference, so I'm posting this to get consensus. Pmffl (talk) 17:25, 23 October 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 23:08, 30 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I just did a quick web search of both names and found that MSHTML appears to be the more formal name. For example, a CVE report from Microsoft calls it MSHTML.[1] This usage is also in another CVE at a different site.[2] Also, on a Microsoft help page, a user asked about Trident and the expert who responded called it MSHTML.[3]

Thus I think MSHTML should be the article name. --Pmffl (talk) 19:22, 31 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

We go by what's common in reliable sources, not what's formal. Nardog (talk) 02:20, 1 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Are you implying those sources are unreliable? If anything, the naming of this browser engine by experts is probably the most relevant factor nowadays. The heyday of Internet Explorer is long past; it's been in sunset mode for at least several years. Since only a dwindling remnant of the general public still uses IE, the more formal naming of this engine by experts is quite relevant. And that's clearly MSHTML. --Pmffl (talk) 18:22, 1 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

No, I'm saying those sources are irrelevant in determining the name of an article. We go by what reliable independent sources call the subject. Nardog (talk) 05:50, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

And as stated before, this ref fits the bill. A non-MS site calling it MSHTML, with explanation that Trident is the alias. --Pmffl (talk) 19:42, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Disagree — as user:PhotographyEdits had stated in the 14 June 2022 move: "Trident is the WP:COMMONNAME", also the article's title was "Trident" over more than one decade, check this link. -- 2.182.210.244 (talk) 04:32, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose moving the page. I still stand by my opinion that Trident is the common name for this software. Thanks for notifying me. PhotographyEdits (talk) 08:44, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Where are references supporting Trident as the common name? Thus far only opinions and assertions. To elaborate what I wrote above, just because Trident was the common name in the past (which I'd agree with), doesn't necessarly mean it's the common name right now. To me, it's a key distinction, given the history of Internet Explorer (and by association, its engine). What was once the dominant browser is now an ever-smaller niche, now well below 1% of the market.[4] That's the context of why I think expert and Microsoft naming carries weight in this decision. But, if there are valid refs supporting Trident, that would be fine too. --Pmffl (talk) 19:55, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose Many current-ish sources use both Tridant and MSHTML in the same article, I suppose we can use which name they see as the primary. (I tried for this to be a random-ish selection of at least somewhat reliable sources from the last year or two.) ghits don't matter a lot but searching for "trident" "windows" browser in their "news" tab (not google news) gives me about 6,660 results while "mshtml" "windows" browser gives me about 1,500.

Trident first (or only):

(only) ComputerWorld April 11, 2022: But Microsoft is not deprecating or removing the Trident engine
(only) ArsTechnica June 15, 2022: IE mode combines the user interface of Edge with IE11's old Trident rendering engine.
(only) ZDNet June 3, 2021: Internet Explorer compatibility feature in Edge, a complete version of IE's Trident engine that runs in the context of an Edge tab
(only) Der Schepp (blog) Jan 2020: Today, the Trident Era Ends
Trident@MDN (this is user generated but generally seen as reliable in the web-space): Trident (or MSHTML) was a layout engine that powered Internet Explorer.

MSHTML first (or only):

(only) kaspersky daily September 8, 2021: An unpatched vulnerability in the MSHTML engine is enabling attacks on Microsoft Office users.
(only) Wired June 20, 2022: Microsoft says it will still support IE’s underlying browser engine, known as "MSHTML,"
DarkReading June 16, 2022: Microsoft meanwhile has retained the MSHTML (aka Trident) IE browser engine as part of Windows 11
PC World 25 May, 2022: And for app developers who embed web content through the MSHTML (Trident) engine
Neowin June 15, 2022: IE mode in Edge is powered by the MSHTML (Trident) engine also utilized by IE11

given the above, I think that Trident is still primary the WP:COMMONNAME and it was definitely the common name for most of its history, so the fact that MSHTML has been somewhat pushed more by Microsoft and reporting on the particular security exploit used MSHTML more, isn't enough to move at this time. Skynxnex (talk) 15:03, 4 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Skynxnex, thanks for that thorough research! But I don't think we can conclude that "Trident is still primary" given that Microsoft clearly has a preference for the MSHTML name (as I linked above), and will likely continue to use it in its official documentation. Like I stated before, since IE and this engine is very much in sunset mode, the documentation from Microsoft is important for this topic going forward (especially for the CVEs).

Whatever the decision here, I intend to flesh out the naming in the article more, with some of these refs. It's too brief right now. But I'll wait until this matter is resolved. (And if Trident is the verdict, I'm okay with that.) --Pmffl (talk) 17:35, 4 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Pmffl please see https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q432145#sitelinks-wikipedia which shows that all other WPs have "Trident" as the article's title, if these are enough, please close this discussion. 5.239.191.47 (talk) 02:47, 6 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Doesn't really matter. What matters is which name makes the most sense right now. And those article names can be changed; it's very easy to do. --Pmffl (talk) 17:37, 6 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Standards compliance

This section is incredibly tame considering how much havoc Trident caused on webdev, modern or not. Was this rewritten by Microsoft? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.197.117.47 (talk) 20:56, 22 March 2023 (UTC)[reply]